NZ passes SelfID

I just put up a post, but it does detail the provisions in the very bad law they passed. I didn't see this one, sorry.

It's full on self-ID, pretty much no restrictions at all and I bet even with the long lead in time they are supposed to have they will essentially bring it in prior. This government isn't afraid to do that at and they certainly don't mind trampling over democratic principles.

Jacinda Ardern just doesn't front this, anything contentious is just thrown down to her incompetent minions.

We have a niece in NZ. DH wondered how she would feel about it. I'm afraid that she won't even be aware of it until something happens that affects her (or her daughter) directly, because legislation seems to be brought in under the radar in so many countries. Even in the UK, I think many people wouldn't know what I was talking about if I raised the subject....

I loathe this authoritarian 'progressive' politics. It has become the anti-thesis of true liberalism that depends on free debate and grass roots discussion. It is all about corporate sponsored think tanks acting as secular priestly caste deciding things on high then organizing training and putting out messages on social media.

" On the same day, they announce ending smoking in the country by the next generation,"

And that could be just as delusional

Final nail in the coffin of moving back there.

Ardern's government is so authoritarian it's disturbing, and the opposition is atrocious so the checks and balances aren't even there.

NZ has gone the same way as Canada sadly.

Both led by a vacuous virtue signaller who’s great at the photo opps and sound bites and appears liberal but is actually under the surface an unpleasant authoritarian misogynist who does not give a flying fuck about women. Straight out of the Nicola Sturgeon school of government.

This also describes the Irish government of the last few years, totally up their own arse but think they are super progressive and wonderful. More concerned with how things look to the outside world than for their own citizens. It's nauseating.

What bothers me so much is that they never asked the public if we were ok with this. They know full well that the vast majority of the voting public would not support this, if they have the full facts. Why are they allowed to just carry on enacting laws that go against what the majority want? So fucking arrogant.

Depressing. So sorry for all the brave and intelligent New Zealand women who have been trying to stop this.

In the same vein it’s seen as ok by our council for men to picket the local hospital with anti abortion placards on the one day a week, I believe, the clinic for abortion services is open.

And meanwhile at least one MP wants to make surrogacy agreements binding meaning a woman who gets second thoughts about an arrangements she has entered into will not be able to have an abortion but will be forced to see it through.

The article mentions that law reform is being discussed, or rather looking to be enforced:

"Labour MP Tāmati Coffey, who, with his partner Tim Smith, welcomed their son Tūtānekai by surrogate in 2019, currently has a members' bill in ballot calling for modern laws for modern families. It includes reform of birth certificates, providing a way
to enforce surrogacy arrangements and creating a register of potential surrogates."

www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/kiwi-mums-heartbreak-after-surrogate-terminates-her-pregnancy-i-went-into-shock/52Y6PO5M4LV73RGZF67TX5E4LU/

From the NZ Herald link in the OP.

This will give the Government opportunity to consult with the rainbow community and receive submissions and ensure the legislation works to support those it concerns.

Dose this mean that a law has been passed but the details are yet to be worked out? Is this the way laws are normally passed in NZ? Or does it mean there may still be time to stop self ID becoming law in 18 months time?

Will there will safeguards put in place which mean women will be protected so they do not need to be consulted because it doesn't concern us? The royal us, I'm not from NZ.

What will it mean for single sex spaces, sports etc? Is sex being retained in equality legislation or is it being replaced with gender?

So many questions.

We'll have a few months of Catherina telling us it's all going swimmingly before - inevitably - N Z gets its very own Barbie Kardashian. Then the plan B swings into action : you're using this vanishingly rare psycho to smear the most fragile bla blah...

Well Posie got there first.

I think it was a street in Wellington iirc, and after the inevitable demand that the sign be taken down a businessman offered his own locations (my memory is hazy here but my phone tells me I took the screen shot on 13 July for anyone searching).

[quote NZGC]NZ passed self ID today - with hardly a ripple. (Currently) it’s not even on the front page of our online news sites. It feels utterly crushing. www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/parliament-passes-self-id-bill-at-third-reading-making-it-easier-for-trans-people-to-update-birth-certificates/M24MBI57SURETEJB5CEVJLEPH4/[/quote]
Brilliant - nothing is going to change for most women. Life is going to get a bit easier for trans people. That's good.

On the same day, they announce ending smoking in the country by the next generation,talk about smoke and mirrors.
Apologies from this Kiwi to all women.

Democracy doesn’t mean the elected representatives will always do what the electorate want, it means the electorate will get the MPs they elect.

Most of the posters here seem to be from the U.K. In the U.K. the parties to the right of the conservatives tend to share the same GC views of the majority of posters here as do many (but by no means all) conservative MPs in the U.K. parliament.

However if there were an election in the U.K. tomorrow and only the posters on this forum could vote I have no doubt they would elect left wing MPs who are open about wanting these left wing policies and then scream furiously while the MPs they elected passed into law the very policies that they promised to pass into law if elected.

There comes a point where my sympathy for left wing GC voters ends.

I think what all these countries previously mentioned (Canada, NZ and Ireland) have in common is they are relatively small with a much larger more dominant neighbour that they actively want to distinguish themselves from. Scotland too obviously but Scotland is actually in a political and financial union with its larger neighbour so harder to get self ID there ( although they are trying!)
I also think these countries like to see they are just ahead of the conversation more progressive than their neighbours when on this matter they are actually just behind in the debate but don’t realise it ( particularly in the U.K. but also in Australia too).
They also just have much smaller populations and so self ID negative impacts are not so easily apparent to most of the population but Ireland is starting to see issues and people are speaking out there now and the same will happen in NZ.
I also disagree NZ is a liberal country, look at how it has treated its expats, 1 million apparently.
NZ has a land mass larger than the U.K. and a tenth of the population.

NZ women, just here to commiserate with you in solidarity. Your government let you down but many of us around the world are on your side. Very sorry.

Couldn't imagine they'd go against the grain, especially as Australia has had self-ID for years without anyone really noticing

Anyone else finding that their reactions to drag acts etc are very much changed? Used to have no issue with drag acts but the vicious parodying of women now just makes me very, very angry.

My Mum used to rant about drag acts, she's not great with women's rights, but drag always bothered her. I used to roll my eyes at how narrow minded she was. Now I agree with her (and you) it's just taking the piss out of women.

I do wonder for how many women this has slipped by. I read the threads on here, did some reading of my own I feel but suspect that had I not done so I wouldn’t have been so opposed. I feel strongly that this issue, as complex as it is, is easily ignored and women who, like me, supported gay rights, abhorred the section 28 legislation etc… could let this just wash over them.

The quiet eradication of woman and women has been truly secretive and as subtle as the methods used in the ‘Handmaid’s Tale’. I watched the documentary ‘Cancelled’’ ( am unsurprised that TVNZ has not picked up the rights to show the documentary down here) and the evidence is clear, to call out this eradication of women is to face threats, loss of income, loss of safety in our legal, physical, emotional, sex based, financial and employment rights. I’m frightened to openly voice my thoughts and am sure I am not alone ( registration to a professional body which supports TW) I cannot afford to lose my registration or job and nor can the majority of other women or even those who already have. The economic gags and realities make me feel very small.

Anyone else finding that their reactions to drag acts etc are very much changed? Used to have no issue with drag acts but the vicious parodying of women now just makes me very, very angry.

Rather a jumbled post, but had to vent my fear, anger and knotted stomach somewhere.

Bizarrely one of the main news items on msn today was about NZ - not about this but the smoking ban...strange priorities. Although the smoking ban is also incredibly authoritarian.