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Original poster

FB Groups and JK

360 replies

SusannaQueen · 05/12/2021 19:26

Ok, I'm just having a rant and I know FB groups are free to set their own rules.
I've been following a fab FB group, (Home for Peculiar Artists 2), post goes up from admin saying this is a reminder, we don't allow anything Harry Potter or JKR related, if you don't know why then educate yourself. Lots of supportive replies.
I'm on the group in my real name, so I'm not going to weigh in, but it hugely fucks me off, so many people just believing lies with no dissent allowed. Just makes me think this whole thing is insurmountable.

OP posts:
Clymene · 05/12/2021 22:08

Oh. That's not really evidence. Nor have you provided any evidence of JKR's transphobia.

And I'm not @CoachBeardless - she and I don't know one another so please don't confuse us.

I was not comparing people who don't like trans ideology with racism. I was comparing misogyny with racism. Unfortunately for a lot of people - including you - those seem to become a bit muddled.

OldCrone · 05/12/2021 22:06

[quote Wavedancer99]@Waitwhat23
Characterizing trans women as "fetishists and predators" and saying that acceptance of trans women is "giving cover to predators" is quite transphobic.

twitter.com/WomenReadWomen/status/1382726124464074752[/quote]
Did you read the tweet that followed that one?

Transgender child rapist Alex Smith, formally known as Matthew Burren, has avoided prison for breaching a sexual harm prevention order due to transgender status, despite the judge stating Smith presents a danger to children.

twitter.com/WomenReadWomen/status/1382770428976926725

A sexual predator avoided being sent to prison by claiming transgender status. Is it transphobic to recognise that sexual predators are now claiming transgender status in order to avoid prison or to be sent to a women's prison?

This is nothing to do with 'acceptance of transwomen' and everything to do with recognising that predators will claim to be transgender if they can gain a benefit by doing so.

CoachBeardless · 05/12/2021 22:06

I didn't say that, another poster did.

Wavedancer99 · 05/12/2021 21:58

@Clymene

Why do you stay in a group that behaves so atrociously? Would you stay in a group that proudly declared no Jews allowed? No blacks!p? No faggots?

I'm guessing not. Why are you prepared to overlook this hatred of a woman speaking out about her experience of domestic violence?

@CoachBeardless Right here.
CoachBeardless · 05/12/2021 21:57

Who are what ones? What are you talking about?

I haven't said any such thing.

I will say that I do not believe that the sex based rights of biological women are less important than the chosen gender of others, and I believe in sex based women's only spaces.

As do most biological women.

Wavedancer99 · 05/12/2021 21:53

[quote CoachBeardless]@Wavedancer99

Comparing people that do not agree with trans ideology with racism? Really?

Get in the sea.
[/quote]
You're the ones who claimed condemning J.K. Rowling's transphobia is "just like saying no blacks or no f*ots".

Wavedancer99 · 05/12/2021 21:51

@Clymene

Yes please *@Wavedancer99 - what @Waitwhat23* said.

And while you're at it, could you please provide the receipts for Helen Joyce and Jennifer Bilek?

Thanks!

Sure thing: twitter.com/christapeterso/status/1416599964214448130
Clymene · 05/12/2021 21:50

Oh okay - I'd forgotten I read this rebuttal from Helen before. thehelenjoyce.com/a-wild-ride/

I don't know much about Bilek. I'm in the U.K. and I find the transatlantic muddying unhelpful.

I'm sorry @SusannaQueen - that's bloody infuriating and saddening in equal measures. Women in the arts is a good page to follow

CoachBeardless · 05/12/2021 21:50

@Wavedancer99

Comparing people that do not agree with trans ideology with racism? Really?

Get in the sea.

Wavedancer99 · 05/12/2021 21:50

@Waitwhat23
Characterizing trans women as "fetishists and predators" and saying that acceptance of trans women is "giving cover to predators" is quite transphobic.

twitter.com/WomenReadWomen/status/1382726124464074752

Original poster
SusannaQueen · 05/12/2021 21:48

@Wavedancer99
I'm perfectly well educated, but thank you for your concern Hmm

@Clymene I won't be staying, that was part of my anger, I've really enjoyed seeing all the different and random artwork pop up every day, but I can't see it in the same light now.

OP posts:
Clymene · 05/12/2021 21:46

Yes please @Wavedancer99 - what @Waitwhat23 said.

And while you're at it, could you please provide the receipts for Helen Joyce and Jennifer Bilek?

Thanks!

Waitwhat23 · 05/12/2021 21:44

That GLAAD link is actually embarrassing (for them). They seem to have quoted perfectly reasonable, rational quotes by her (I mean, health professionals are concerned about children being pushed towards hormones etc) and have just put the words 'anti trans' in front of them.

Yet again, there is a whole essay in which JKR discussed these issues. @wavedancer99 please quote just one sentence which is 'transphobic'. Just one.

Wavedancer99 · 05/12/2021 21:42

[quote CoachBeardless]@Wavedancer99 Hmm

I can't see any issue with any of her actual quotes. They're all the truth. [/quote]
Yeah, and that's the problem, you don't see an issue with transphobia. A trans-supportive person does.

Racist rants are also "the truth" to a racist, misogynistic rants are "the truth" to a misogynist (and I mean actual misogynist that believes in women's biological inferiority, not someone who happens to support trans people).

Believing that bigotry is "the truth" does not mean it's not bigotry.

Wavedancer99 · 05/12/2021 21:39

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

CoachBeardless · 05/12/2021 21:35

@Wavedancer99 Hmm

I can't see any issue with any of her actual quotes. They're all the truth.

Wavedancer99 · 05/12/2021 21:31

@SusannaQueen

Ok, I'm just having a rant and I know FB groups are free to set their own rules. I've been following a fab FB group, (Home for Peculiar Artists 2), post goes up from admin saying this is a reminder, we don't allow anything Harry Potter or JKR related, if you don't know why then educate yourself. Lots of supportive replies. I'm on the group in my real name, so I'm not going to weigh in, but it hugely fucks me off, so many people just believing lies with no dissent allowed. Just makes me think this whole thing is insurmountable.
You're quite welcome to actually educate yourself.

www.glaad.org/gap/jk-rowling

Forgotthebins · 05/12/2021 21:26

Zandas suggestion of sharing the JKR essay as a helpful service, is excellent.

Clymene · 05/12/2021 21:22

Why do you stay in a group that behaves so atrociously? Would you stay in a group that proudly declared no Jews allowed? No blacks!p? No faggots?

I'm guessing not. Why are you prepared to overlook this hatred of a woman speaking out about her experience of domestic violence?

Motorina · 05/12/2021 21:21

(I could be persuaded by the argument that Carrot is a transdwarf, mind. But only once I've stopped spluttering in outrage at the rest of the nonsense.)

Motorina · 05/12/2021 21:19

@Waitwhat23 must not rant. Must NOT rant.

The women in Monstrous Regiment aren't trans. They're women. Who have discovered the power of a good sock.

Grrr...

Whitefire · 05/12/2021 21:12

It's just so tedious. Anyway my 9 and 15 year old dd's are very much HP fans (never tickled my fancy) so will be having many a themed present. At the recent Halloween disco the youngest and many of her classmates went as HP characters, a few vocal twits on FB aren't making much difference.

Waitwhat23 · 05/12/2021 21:12

@motorina the only views allowed about Monstrous Regiment are even worse. No concept of the fact that the women live in a massively patriarchal society and need to pretend to be men to do what they want to do (find their brother, stay with their lover, escape sexual abuse in a girl's home). Nope, they're all trans (apparently).

And Cheery is female in a society that is so male default that they won't even acknowledge that women exist - there's a mention in one of the books that they know women exist (they have mothers after all) but don't mention it. But no, trans. Or in the ridiculous adaption, non binary

Motorina · 05/12/2021 20:58

@Waitwhat23

I'm seriously considering leaving a Terry Pratchett group because of the amount of really vitriolic posts aimed at anyone who believes that you can't actually change sex and who doesn't firmly believe that the dwarf character Cheery is trans. No discussion, only capitulation.

Another geeky Facebook group is determined to declare one member 'brave and stunning' despite the fact he is clearly getting his kicks from a captive audience but any mention of JKR is essentially shut down with 'not suitable for this group - be kind'. I've been a member of that group for years.

What??? The whole point of the Cheery story arc is that she is both female and outwardly feminine, in a way which is profoundly counter-cultural for a dward. Although still through quite a dwarven lens.

If anything, she's the only cis-female dwarf on the Disc. Although given she has a very big axe, there's no way I'd be calling her cis to her face.

Please don't tell me what a God-awful ideological mess they've made of Monstrous Regiment.

Skysblue · 05/12/2021 20:39

I’ve seen this. Livid about it, but not enough to defend her publicly in my professional name when so many people have got fired for basically doing that.

One example I’ve seen was someone in FB The group buying JK’s books to use them in competitions to attract readers to their own (bad) writing, but state that they only buy the books second-hand to ensure JK doesn’t profit. Wtf. So they want to make money by basically stealing her brand, but they don’t want her to get the tiny amount of royalties she’s legally owed. And they think this gives them the moral highground.