A woman driven out of her therapy group by a trans woman's presence

As I said... Lots of knowledgeable women on here (not me though )

Not links, these get deleted. Just enough info so we can find them ourselves, or ask whose interested and pm us the links.

I hope you have taken some comfort from the huge amount of support you have on this board. There is an incredible amount of knowledge here, and some amazing women fighting on all of our behalf. Please do not be afraid to reach out to them. Please do keep us updated, and post any links to petitions & crowdfunding.

Thank you Sarah for telling your story. Bloody awful that men are allowed to do this

And they are enabled to do this by services

I hope you have obtained some comfort from knowing that many, many women are with you on this.

Thank you. Tbh it is a good distraction from the reason I attended the centre in the first place.

I don't have the headspace to deal with my sexual violence without support so have to bury those feelings for now. I do feel able to make this challenge.

Solidarity with you Sarah. I do believe that all these legal challenges add up and will eventually make the change which returns womens services to the people who need them (Women). Must have been hard for you but you do have an army of support behind you and many of us will donate to a legal fund to challenge this. Sometimes the anger at the unfairness keeps you going!

More power to you, Sarah. I can't believe women have to even consider this when our rights are enshrined clearly in law.

Thanks again everyone. Busy morning.

My main priority is putting together a legal challenge. I want to make rape crisis organisations obliged to apply the EA exception and offer a single sex service even if the CEO / Trustees personally do not believe it is justified and absolutely believe TWAW.

I wish I was even surprised by this, but nothing surprises, or indeed shocks me anymore. It's just so heartbreakingly sad for women who need a safe place to discuss their experiences.

for IamSarah. You are one very courageous woman.

Iamsarah Just adding and thank you for committing to updating us, but I'm sure now, lots will be following developments

This was in 2014 when the services were still single sex. I've looked the group's website now and it goes to great lengths to avoid any indication that it is single sex or inclusive. This may be to avoid a backlash or it could mean it too has been captured or it is being careful to avoid attention and a backlash

So by their rules, an abuser could join the group, make anyone who disagrees leave, then basically enjoy the distress of others and that stories of abuse. They would never be questioned or challenged? They could just sit and say nothing at all, no evidence of abuse or trauma and basically ‘enjoy the show’. Is that right?

I attended the Freedom Program and another support group for survivors of domestic abuse run by women's aid in my area. I couldn't have attended in the circumstances Sarah found. My abuser was a trans woman and one of the many was they abused me was sexual abuse during which they were a dominatrix.

*There is no interest within this political movement for the wellbeing of female women and while they are passionate about inclusion and inclusivity, it is their own inclusion that they are passionate about; not the inclusion of all other women. The argument is that sex differences are irrelevant among women; however one group of women's needs get met at the expense of the other, and the other group of women can subordinate themselves and obey or do without services in punishment. And you can split that group of women into male and female.

It is an inability to tolerate other women having their needs met or being permitted accessibility. Even when their own accessibility and priority and greater importance has been thoroughly affirmed and provided for. It is dog in the manger. It is selfish. It is intolerant. It is discriminatory. And it's entirely sex based and sexist in its thinking, which really throws a lot of confusion on the idea of mixing sex in women's spaces because sex isn't a defining thing.*

I agree. The more worrying thing is that we live in a society which accepts this. There will always be some people who are narcissistic because of psychopathy or trauma (or both), so there will always be people who consider that the only needs whose matter are theirs. However the fact that society has so readily accepted this is clear evidence of the disparity and misogyny which women have to live with. I.e. the very erosion of protected spaces for women is evidence of the need for it. Sarah, so sorry to hear of the abuse you've suffered both at the hands of specific men and then at the hands of this corrupt system. Thank you for standing up for women.

I've been thinking more and surely the support needs of a transwoman [who has been abused] are incredibly different to that of a woman, a group of women are not going to be able to relate to the experiences and feelings of the TW. A TW deserves tailored support and one would hope that the centre recognises this. It is just once you have pinned your TWAW colours to the mast you have to completely stand by it, even to the detriment of everyone.

You can bet that that transwoman is in no way a victim. They are there to exactly bask in what happened.

The official ‘party line’ from TRAs, Stonewall et al is now that no-one LITERALLY believes TWAW but that they are woman-gender…. yet these awful policies only work if TWAliterallyW. If TWAliterally W, there’s no justification for separate TW groups(or TM but no one ever seems to consider TM..).

It’s yet more proof, it such were needed, that this isn’t anything to do with actual rights for genuine TW/TM but simply an obeisance to MRA. Again.

I can't get my head around that there are suitable facilities for trans women, but they are still allowed to use a facility that should only be for biological women. I can only conclude that it is either;
A person making mischief.
or
A person getting off on another's distress.
Both are WRONG.
And why don't those running the show understand that?

Some great points. This is everything you need to know about this shocking failure:

‘I'm so sorry the system has failed you. A misogynistic society in which women are fair game and easy pickings for men to rape and harm is the first monumental failing. Then the justice system fails us. Even those whose cases do make it into court have our characters assassinated there, and convictions are woefully low. Now even the resources we use to try to heal are no longer viable.’

‘Pretty sure that research found that 97% of women have been victims of sexual harassment. Rather more than the less than 20% of trans people who are victims.’

And then there’s the trans women that offered none of their own experiences whilst listening to women’s trauma .

On one hand this looks like woefully inadequate provision and on the other it looks like deliberately worsening the trauma…

This is awful. Sarah you are so brave.

Mothers having to complete courses to satisfy Social Services so they cannot leave.
Women being told what to think and say.

Women who are too uncomfortable so get no support (and thus the ‘data’ starts to show a decrease in women needing these services and and increase by comparison of TW - making them look more vulnerable as a group).

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

and @GreenWillowTree

as well as the that I sent to @IamSarah earlier and also sending to every other woman reading this that has been put in a similar awful situation.

This cannot be allowed to continue.