Anti trans for asking not to conflate sex with gender?

Transmen are female.

I have no idea if you are confused or a biology denier!

Can't cope with the language being so heavily bastardised

"I mean, presumably trans men know they are women otherwise they wouldn't be trans right?"

Trans men are men, and they know they are men. They also know their own bodies. That has nothing to do with including them as people in this event.

As someone currently “experiencing menopause” for the fifty fucking thousand times only biological women no matter they bloody identify experience menopause

Biological men do not and i am sick to fucking death of being patronised by members of the sex who do not go through menopause about this

Some people experience menopause, and I guess this event was for people who experience menopause.

All those people are female. Don't you think it would be useful to have a word for female people? How about 'women'. And male people could be called 'men'. What do you think?

Do you want them to make a statement that "only women have menopause" to deliberately exclude trans men?

Oh no we can't have that can we?

I mean, presumably trans men know they are women otherwise they wouldn't be trans right?

And if they are actual trans men, their 'menopause' comes crashing at them about 30 years too early.

So it is a COMPLETELY different scenario.

So totally right to say only women have menopause.

Some people experience menopause, and I guess this event was for people who experience menopause. Some of those people are women, and some of them are men.

Unless you think women aren't people ,or you don't think trans men are men and that is so upsetting to you that you can't cope with it, I don't understand what your objection is.

It has nothing to do with sex being a protected characteristic at all.

Do you want them to make a statement that "only women have menopause" to deliberately exclude trans men?

Point in case - having to refer to menopause (a uniquely femal biological function) as hormone deficiency syndrome. It's wrong on so many levels not least because it signifies the menopause, a perfectly natural process, as some kind illness or disease.

As I've said upthread, people who menstruate is not accurate when talking about the menopause and the group it affects - some will have stopped menstruating but still be going through other symptoms. The word women, or at the very least females covers everyone who would be affected by the menopause.

If the word woman encompasses everyone, it becomes meaningless.

I agree. But this is precisely not about widening the definition of "woman". It is about acknowledging that "woman" is not wide enough to encompass all those who (under the new theory) menstruate. Women are a subset of menstruators. There are some female men who menstruate.

I can't really see what males get from it

The comments could've been from anyone falling anywhere on the 'gender spectrum'. One simply has to spend 5 minutes on Twitter to see the vitriol levelled at women defending their rights. It comes from men, other women and everything else in-between.

In terms of how men benefit from mangling the language - if we can't properly define ourselves it prevents us from naming our discrimination. It prevents us from organising into groups to fight said discrimination. If we can't name the problem we can't fight against it. If the word woman encompasses everyone, it becomes meaningless. Were targeted specifically because of our sex so it's imperative we're able to accurately define ourselves and the issue.

If we can't organise, name and fight males benefit from "keeping us in our place"

NearlyThereMum

A TERF is a Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminist.

It is basically a person who does not believe that men who identify as women - transwomen - are actual women. A TERF can be female or male.

It is used as a derogatory term by trans activists against women and men who campaign to preserve female only sex based spaces - such as toilets, changing rooms, hospital wards etc - to ensure privacy to women and girls from men who identify as women but retain their biological male genitals.

A few years ago I was working in a Civil Service role and someone commented on an intranet comments section, referring to 'terfs'. I reported the comment as an inappropriate and abusive way to refer to colleagues and the comment was removed. The poster got a warning which I learned about when he complained about it on yammer.

All of the above are excellent points.

I’m also uncomfortable with using medicalised terms like syndrome for something that’s perfectly natural and normal for women to go through as I feel there’s then an implication that you can therefore ‘fix’ it with medication.

It’s also again using unfamiliar and unclear terms in order to placate a very small group at the expense of much larger groups of very vulnerable people (elderly people, people with learning disabilities, people with English as a second language, people with literacy issues). The same way that 40% of women don’t know if they have a cervix so cervix haver is useless. This is creating barriers to healthcare for really vulnerable groups.

In Australia our sex and gender guidelines state that gender and sex continue to remain separate and distinct categories, but can be used interchangeably including in legislation. So not super helpful but it's saying that yes female is the district biological category. If this talk was solely about female biology I would give feedback on their miscategorisation and conflation with gender. Maybe check your guidelines or act for some guidance. Also the declaration on women's sex based rights is helpful.

Eg Sex and gender continue to be separate concepts entirely and I see little progress for women if our ability to describe and classify ourselves is misrepresented, particularly when speaking to a group of women about female biological functions.
Our organisation must ensure the full development and advancement of women and respect their human rights to be recognised as their sex class, for fundamental freedoms on a basis of equality.

Sorry - ignore me. Posted on the wrong thread. Have asked MN to delete.

Brain fog!!!

I've been perimenopausal for several years now. The gaps between my periods vary from 15 to 90 days. It took a couple of years for my periods to settle into a pattern when I was a teenager.

What do they mean by 'person who menstruates'? Someone who is currently menstruating, will menstruate in the next 2-3 weeks or has menstruated in the past? I can't be the only woman who doesn't know if I'm still a menstruator.

Menopause is not a malfunction, it’s a natural process. It’s what women’s bodies are designed to do.

Shall we describe type 1 diabetes as a hormone deficiency syndrome too? It is factually correct.

Raising awareness of how menopause affects women in the workplace is vitally important and I'm so glad it is no longer a taboo subject, but it feels like someone used this as an opportunity to shame women.

I work in private sector so we don't really have awareness raising or workshops like this. What we do have is professional adults who use their common sense to understand sometimes people experience things that can impact their work.

I think I know which I prefer

“TheFlamingnerd
It's targeted harassment. Bet it was men on the call doing this“

The horrible thing is that there might have been women saying this too.

It's not just the protected characteristic of sex that is being ignored here, it's also age. Yes, some women go through an early menopause (my oldest friend did following cancer treatment in her 20s), but usually it's 'women of a certain age'. It's bloody hard enough being an older woman at work without more sticks to be beaten with