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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

HSBC advert: gender should never be a barrier to opportunity

64 replies

InvisibleDragon · 24/11/2021 10:38

Came across a billboard with this HSBC advertising campaign on it the other day (see the picture - not the billboard I saw, but a similar image from facebook). Was initially mildly irritated at the continued conflation of sex and gender.

But then I noticed something else. In this case, "gender" isn't being used as a euphemism for "sex", it means gender identity.

The people in the images are both (presumably) non-binary men or trans women and the web page links to details about how to change your bank account to have gender neutral title:
www.hsbc.co.uk/opportunity/

www.hsbc.co.uk/help/banking-made-easy/change-of-gender/

I have no issue with HSBC wanting to make life easier for people with a non-binary gender identity (presumably you can also be addressed as Reverend or Rabbi in line with other beliefs). But I really don't like the use of "gender" to mean just the state of having a non-binary / trans gender identity. This feels like a further step in making it harder to name women as a (sex) class. First we had gender as a euphemism for sex. Then we had gender meaning basically gender identity or sex as preferred. This advert is using gender to mean "minority gender identity." (i.e. trans or non binary) Combined with the taboo around naming biological sex as a sex class, this feels concerning.

I'm now also side-eyeing the euphemism "gender based violence," which is becoming increasingly popular in Scotland as a replacement for "violence against women and girls."

Have I gone full tin-foil hat here, or is this worth taking notice of?

HSBC advert: gender should never be a barrier to opportunity
HSBC advert: gender should never be a barrier to opportunity
OP posts:
MostNamesAreTaken · 24/11/2021 11:58

Link from here hsbc.taleo.net/careersection/external/joblist.ftl#

MostNamesAreTaken · 24/11/2021 11:56

Anyone seen HSBC's equality statement on UK job adverts?

So many things they don't discriminate against (which can only be positive). Though some interesting omissions from the list...

HSBC advert: gender should never be a barrier to opportunity
ErrolTheDragon · 24/11/2021 11:53

I see some signs our legislators (some MPs, some peers) are waking up to the need for clarity in language and referring to sex.

It's unfortunate that 'gender' as straightforward alternative to 'sex' has been broken. A phrase such as 'gender based violence' doesn't translate well to 'sex based violence as that sounds more like sexual violence than violence committed predominantly by one sex on the other. Similarly with the 'gender pay gap'.

Gncq · 24/11/2021 11:47

It's more gaslighting really isn't it.

A campaign "Gender identity should never be a barrier to opportunity" yes, great, no problems here. Of course it shouldn't.

What they've done is make it really vague, knowing most people conflate gender/sex.

They're basically pretending they're trying to improve sex based oppression but they're not.

They're trying to disguise a move to actively increase sex based oppression- by pretending it doesn't exist or matter, in a costume that looks to many like they're working to reduce it.

Nellodee · 24/11/2021 11:43

Is what you are saying that first, we moved away from man and woman being descriptors of sex and towards them being descriptors of gender, but that this advert seems to be moving away from man and woman as gender classes being important and towards cis and trans being the most important dividing line?

PaleBlueMoonlight · 24/11/2021 11:39

@OldCrone

I've thought this for a while.

It started with the Stonewall-led misquoting of the equality act, with 'sex' being replaced by 'gender' and 'gender reassignment' by 'gender identity'. So instead of two distinct and obviously different protected characteristics (sex and gender reassignment) we had, two that appeared to be the same, or very similar (gender and gender identity).

The end game seemed to me to be to replace the two current protected characteristics with 'gender' or 'gender identity', removing sex altogether and also removing any suggestion that changing 'gender' should involve any physical changes to the body, as is implied by the term 'gender reassignment'.

We need to keep fighting against this.

Yes, this is exactly how I see it.
InvisibleDragon · 24/11/2021 11:29

For me, what's new is that:

  • HSBC now has an option to use a title like"Mx" if desired (not so exciting)
  • In their campaign to publicize this, they are using "gender" to mean exclusively "minority gender identity" rather than the more usual "gender identity or sex as preferred". That seems to me to be a further development that makes it increasingly harder to refer to women as a group (at all!) let alone women as a sex class.
OP posts:
PaleGreenGhost · 24/11/2021 11:22

@nauticant

I wonder what's new? Pipps Bunce is already proof that banks can be very accepting to men of both genders.
This. All evidence points to male bodied people getting ahead in life in the UK, regardless of gender ID.

The day I take any organisation seriously on caring about trans people is the day I see them admitting that the biggest threat globally to transwomen is the sex industry. But they can't because they've been sold a thought package that includes the promotion of sex work as well as TWAW. Almost as if the whole thing has fuck all to do with transexuals and rather a lot to do with keeping women down.

PoisonCrystal · 24/11/2021 11:14

We need to keep fighting against this.

We do. It's deeply embedded, though. For instance, I'm watching a work webcast about Anti-Bullying Week at the very moment. The Head of EDI had a slide that listed "Sex" as a protected characteristic. However, later on in his presentation he said "Gender" instead.

OldCrone · 24/11/2021 11:06

I've thought this for a while.

It started with the Stonewall-led misquoting of the equality act, with 'sex' being replaced by 'gender' and 'gender reassignment' by 'gender identity'. So instead of two distinct and obviously different protected characteristics (sex and gender reassignment) we had, two that appeared to be the same, or very similar (gender and gender identity).

The end game seemed to me to be to replace the two current protected characteristics with 'gender' or 'gender identity', removing sex altogether and also removing any suggestion that changing 'gender' should involve any physical changes to the body, as is implied by the term 'gender reassignment'.

We need to keep fighting against this.

nauticant · 24/11/2021 10:55

It's sneakily effective isn't it? "There's a big problem of gender based violence" refers to violence against women and girls but presented in a way so as to be understood to be violence against certain people because of their gender identities. Which is possibly a very rare occurrence. Talk about appropriation.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 24/11/2021 10:50

I'm now also side-eyeing the euphemism "gender based violence," which is becoming increasingly popular in Scotland as a replacement for "violence against women and girls."

Have I gone full tin-foil hat here, or is this worth taking notice of?

Worth attention.

nauticant · 24/11/2021 10:49

I wonder what's new? Pipps Bunce is already proof that banks can be very accepting to men of both genders.

CrossPurposes · 24/11/2021 10:47

It might be easier if we just did away with titles. I've always been puzzled that they are often a required field and never satisfied with any reason given for that requirement.

HSBC advert: gender should never be a barrier to opportunity