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Original poster

Stonewall?

85 replies

N00tN00t · 10/11/2021 08:54

I am writing an assignment for college, I have chosen to write about stonewall in businesses. It is a both sides argument essay, and I have been trying to research the effects of stonewall in businesses and companies.

When I started a couple of months ago, there was a lot of websites for both sides, but now when I type anything into Google, it is only coming back with stonewall the website, the history of stonewall or ways to sign up and become a diversity champion. ALL of it is the 'good side' argument. Does anyone know what has happened? I know when I started there was a lot of other results from many different points of view. Can anyone give me some places to go so I can do a balanced assignment?

OP posts:
HoardingSamphireSaurus · 10/11/2021 11:53

The Stonewall SEO bods must be hard at work Smile

Original poster
N00tN00t · 10/11/2021 11:41

You're right, it did bring up different results. Although, still not the ones I had previously. More of a mix, though, so that's good.

OP posts:
HoardingSamphireSaurus · 10/11/2021 11:30

Yes, but that's to be expected.

use issues with stonewall in business and you get the results you might expect.

Manderleyagain · 10/11/2021 11:24

It is a bit alarming that the Google results have changed recently though.

GoodieMoomin · 10/11/2021 11:23

Not sure if anyone has already said this but try using different search engines. Duckduckgo or ecosia usually give different results to google

titchy · 10/11/2021 11:22

Sorry cross posted with others who said the same thing Blush

titchy · 10/11/2021 11:21

Don't use google as your search engine! It's very very easy for organisations to decide which links are returned first due to the way the google algorithm works. Duck duck go is apparently much better.

Original poster
N00tN00t · 10/11/2021 11:17

It's HE business management. I was thinking of referencing specific pages with links in them. Mainly because references aren't included in the word count and I want to get as much info in as possible.

OP posts:
Manderleyagain · 10/11/2021 11:16

I had to have a look. There is a little bit in 2017 eg
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3069102-Stonewall-really-are-throwing-women-udner-the-bus-arent-they-sad

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/academics_corner/3055290-Stonewall-survey

But things really get underway in 2018

HoardingSamphireSaurus · 10/11/2021 11:16

@N00tN00t

It would be great if I could reference mumsnet discussions which have links in them etc. I might look into that. I'm not sure whether it could be considered a reasonable source for this purpose, though.
You could, if you referred to us as 'social commentary' and that would allow you to draw from Twitter too, to illustrate the polemic across some Social Media platforms, and your own balance!
ChateauMargaux · 10/11/2021 11:14

I loved when I read things like 'they ALL wanted to talk about it and none of them had anything good to say about how things have turned out. They're 19-23. ' . Thank you for sharing, it all seems so negative sometimes and that the damage is well and truly done. I was watching a Netflix drama, Guilty. and at the end, there are gender neutral toilets where the sinks were in a row and the stalls were open at the top and the bottom.. it felt like this brainwashing was everywhere.. I am so pleased to read that your colleagues are open to hearing the risks associated with the erasure of sex based protections for women and the damage that is done by entrenching stereotypes rather than seeking to erase them instead.

Thelnebriati · 10/11/2021 11:11

Stonewall's submission to the GRA consultation, their comments about how single sex services are actually single 'gender' and should include people who do not have a GRC are at the bottom of page 7;

''61. Under the Equality Act 2010, the protected characteristic of ‘gender reassignment’ ensures most trans people can access single-sex services in line with their gender, and are not required to obtain a Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC), or have undergone any form of medical intervention, to be eligible for support in these services.''
committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/17743/pdf/

The Equality Act uses 'sex' when they mean biological sex. Single sex services are legal in several situations, including;
''they may be used by more than one person and a woman might object to the presence of a man (or vice versa)''
www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/notes/division/3/16/20/7/4/1

PatsArrow · 10/11/2021 11:10

Politicians have referenced Mumsnet in Parliament before now. I think using MN as a source, mentioning it is perfectly suitable.

dotoallasyouwouldbedoneby · 10/11/2021 11:09

They have been accepted as 'experts' across the board of equalities when they really just represent the T.

dotoallasyouwouldbedoneby · 10/11/2021 11:07

@HoardingSamphireSaurus

And don't forget the wishy washy term used by various government departments - it's not value for money!
Showing their fear...ridiculous for the elected Government.
dotoallasyouwouldbedoneby · 10/11/2021 11:06

@N00tN00t

I understand that *@Babdoc* but it does have to be a balanced essay. I spoke to my tutor yesterday as I was a bit worried about writing on it, but he was really keen for me to do it. He said it would be his first assignment submitted on it and he was really interested in the little bit of detail I went into. So now I'm trying to write something that gets the message across without it being biased one way.
You've got to remember that there is zero scientific basis for gender identity ideology and that until very recently it did not exist. It is very cult like and was probably about keeping Stonewall in a job once gay marriage had become a reality.
Manderleyagain · 10/11/2021 11:05

I don't know what your subject is, but imo (someone who has taught in HE in the humanities) mumsnet discussions could be a source if you use them for what they are. For example they could illustrate that there has been discussions on social media and Internet forums for longer than its been reported in the media, or that this forum has been a key site of discussion if that was a point you wanted to make. But I don't think they can be a sauce for factual information given in posts (sorry everyone). You can use advanced search to find key words in thread titles on this board (tick feminism sex & gender discussions). It would be interesting to know when fwr first started talking about stonewall.

Lovelyricepudding · 10/11/2021 11:03

Unbiased evidence can still point firmly in one direction.

timeisnotaline · 10/11/2021 10:54

The fca consultation is a good one from a business perspective, as it will basically require all fca regulated companies to count transwomen as women for all gender quotas if they go ahead with their proposal- stealth law!

Original poster
N00tN00t · 10/11/2021 10:54
Grin
OP posts:
Original poster
N00tN00t · 10/11/2021 10:52

It would be great if I could reference mumsnet discussions which have links in them etc. I might look into that. I'm not sure whether it could be considered a reasonable source for this purpose, though.

OP posts:
HoardingSamphireSaurus · 10/11/2021 10:51

I'm not suggesting @purpleboy is a bad faith poster, honest Smile , but maybe start a thread with your key findings instead.

I am sure many here would like to read that!

Original poster
N00tN00t · 10/11/2021 10:48

Kind of, except the conclusion still needs to be third person and unbiased. I'm happy to share it with you when it is done, @purpleboy although it is going to be the first proper assignment I have ever written, left school at 15 and finally back in education in my 30s. So I'm not promising it will be good 😬

OP posts:
Crouton19 · 10/11/2021 10:48

Last month’s news on the FCA, SW and the proposed definition of women as relates to composition of company board members would be relevant here.

HoardingSamphireSaurus · 10/11/2021 10:46

@ahagwearsapointybonnet

I'm assuming that a "balanced" essay means you examine the claims and evidence on each side impartially and even-handedly, but that the conclusion should be determined by the evidence on each side, rather than you having to "sit on the fence"?
That would depend upon the essay title and end result OP has set for herself.

The conclusion could simply be that the current situation remains in flux, hotly contended!