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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Kathleen Stock’s union betrays her.

190 replies

MangoSeason · 12/10/2021 11:17

Pathetic. Weak. Craven.

twitter.com/Docstockk/status/1447863827018702855?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

OP posts:
happydappy2 · 12/10/2021 13:37

I've just bought her book-as a way to show support-I hope she's alright.

PattiPritell · 12/10/2021 13:36

I think we should start to take issue with the term transphobia. It is used as a silencing tool and I sometimes think that it is given far too credence. A fear is one thing, a hatred is another

I will email the BBc about this point - it is ridiculous when you think about it - I might hate someone or something or disagree with something or someone but it's not a phobia.

PattiPritell · 12/10/2021 13:33

Yes, I struggled to make sense of it and I see it is signed by Executive and Reps whoever that is. Without names it is a bit meaningless to most people.

GCAcademic · 12/10/2021 13:32

@MargaritaPie

The letter didn't say anything about ending anyone's career did it? It seems to just say it is against transphobia and inequalities. So why is Prof Stock so offended by it?
You do seem to need a lot of pretty basic things spelt out to you, don't you?
JoodyBlue · 12/10/2021 13:30

want to say "don't feed the troll"

NutellaEllaElla · 12/10/2021 13:28

I've read it a few times, it's completely incoherent isn't it?

MargaritaPie · 12/10/2021 13:22

The letter didn't say anything about ending anyone's career did it? It seems to just say it is against transphobia and inequalities. So why is Prof Stock so offended by it?

Riapia · 12/10/2021 13:20

It contained a link to a policy document endorsed by the UK-wide union that states: “UCU has a long history of enabling members to self-identify, whether that is being black, disabled, LGBT+ or women.

Being able to identify as a different sex was never going to satisfy these cunts.

Being able to identify as disabled?

FFS when will these twats be satisfied.

yourhairiswinterfire · 12/10/2021 13:18

Has Kathleen Stock ever even said anything transphobic?

Nope, but nobody's going to let that get in the way of a good witch-hunting harassment campaign.

CatsOperatingInGangs · 12/10/2021 13:14

I’m so angry about this. So angry.
This situation has been allowed to spiral out of control because the University failed to stand up and support Prof Stock years ago.
I hope she is considering taking legal action against them. Fucks sake, there’s a lot of really angry women out there more than happy to chip in to a fighting fund.

Dotoallasyouwouldbedoneby · 12/10/2021 13:03

@JoodyBlue

I think we should start to take issue with the term transphobia. It is used as a silencing tool and I sometimes think that it is given far too credence. A fear is one thing, a hatred is another. The "be kind" mantra appealing to female socialisation and acceptance of others is pretty revealing that the majority of women don't participant in hatred. Fear on the other hand is entirely rational when it comes to men. Males are stronger than women and we know that sufficient male born people wish harm to women. Being afraid is rational. The easy banding about of the word transphobia is part of the control technique isn't it? It is really disgusting behaviour.
The other one used is to say 'if you think that, you must be a bigot then'... I must re-read '1984'.....Orwell was only a few years out of kilter it seems.
ChristinaXYZ · 12/10/2021 13:00

If we don't like the politics of our unions then we should stop paying our subs. Many of the TUC related ones seem very male and have been slow to protect women.

Alternatives to standard captured unions include:

Affinity

workaffinity.co.uk/

"Affinity represents thousands of people working in a wide range of industries including banking and finance, accountancy, retail, manufacturing, education, the law, hospitality and travel and tourism. Its members include teachers, bank staff, IT consultants, financial advisers, academics, local government staff, lawyers and civil servants.

"Currently in its centenary year, Affinity is different to most trade unions in that it has no party political affiliations, is not a member of the Trades Union Congress and has no ties to the employers it deals with, leaving it free to protect the rights and interests of its members without fear or favour."

There is also the Workers of England Union

workersofengland.co.uk

If you're a member of the Free Speech Union then there are discount offers for joining the above - you should check your membership emails. freespeechunion.org/

For teachers there is also Edapt which is legal cover and employment advice - they're not strictly speaking a union.

www.edapt.org.uk/

Igmum · 12/10/2021 12:58

Wrong wrong wrong wrong. This is appalling. On this logic our next generation of doctors and nurses will be unable to differentiate between the sexes. And that will severely impact trans healthcare as well as the rest of us. At least this letter is only from the local branch, but I don't hold out much hope of UCU high command rejecting it.

RedDogsBeg · 12/10/2021 12:54

UCU has a long history of enabling members to self-identify, whether that is being black, disabled, LGBT+ or women.

So, UCU were fulsome in their support for Rachel Dolzeal, weren't they? They rallied the troops to condemn the abuse RD received and explicitly stated that RD was right, they did didn't they?

lionheart · 12/10/2021 12:48

This is Sussex UCU so it will be interesting to see if the national organisation will deviate from this utterly craven backstabbing crap.

I suspect we know the answer.

ArtemesiaK · 12/10/2021 12:47

Has Kathleen Stock ever even said anything transphobic? Stating biological facts is not transphobic. What on earth do biology profs teach these days?

Bollockstothat · 12/10/2021 12:37

Agree with all that, thecatfromjapan

Even fairly recently, though, UCU were better - their campaigns were focused on limited goals (adding 1% to a pay offer, say) that were, in theory, achievable. That's all gone out of the window these days. But then, it's so much easier, so much sexier, to take a righteous stand on Israel than to put in the hard, morally impure, work of negotiation in favour of your members' interests.

I imagine that university management and the government are delighted by UCU in its current form - shouty, ineffectual, virtue wankers whose only real acheivement is to alienate normal people.

dworky · 12/10/2021 12:34

Betrays all women.

StellaAndCrow · 12/10/2021 12:34

@Sicario

And in The Times today, "Members can identify as black, disabled or female, university union insists"

A union that represents academics has reasserted a commitment to allowing its members to self-identify as being black, disabled or female.

A Twitter post by the Edinburgh branch of the University and College Union (UCU) said: “A reminder of UCU’s strong position in support of trans inclusion. Liberation cannot be built on exclusion”.

It contained a link to a policy document endorsed by the UK-wide union that states: “UCU has a long history of enabling members to self-identify, whether that is being black, disabled, LGBT+ or women.

“UCU supports a social, rather than a medical, model of gender recognition that will help challenge repressive gender stereotypes in the workplace and in society.”

One staff member at Edinburgh University, who asked not to be named for fear of reprisals, claimed that trans rights activists within the union were seeking to “weaponise” the issue and force out academics who expressed scepticism over the concept of self-identification.

Interesting that it mentions being able to self-identify as a woman, but doesn't mention self-identifying as a man. I wonder why?

And is it ok to self-identify as black these days then? Cos there's some BAME support groups round here that sound really interesting, and a scholarship for black women. . .
NO OF COURSE IT'S NOT OK!!

ANewCreation · 12/10/2021 12:30

Yet again, the UCU with trans and non binary people being the 'most vulnerable' trope.

So Kathleen Stock OBE, a lesbian woman, has had calls for her to be fired from students(?) in masks/balaclavas, smoke bombs, police concern regarding her physical safety, death and rape threats, colleagues openly sounding off against her, a union apparently against her and against the recent expression of support she received from the university - though she had been left twisting in the wind for months before.

Yet somehow, this community of trans and non binary people is most vulnerable at Sussex.

Seriously, more vulnerable than Kathleen right now?? Let's not forget her 'crime' - because she has the temerity to be part of LGBAlliance and believes in the material reality of sex.

And surely calling for unequivocal support without knowing if some members of the community are actually engaged in the harassment and bullying is a potentially risky move by UCU?

Obviously UCU will have actual documented proof of worse bullying and harassment for trans and non binary staff members at the University, yes?

In which case, wow.

thecatfromjapan · 12/10/2021 12:23

Unions really, really need to re-organise in the face of massive changes to working conditions in the 21st century.

My feeling is that the solution UCU have chosen (become a signaller of ideological and cultural positions) is strategically terrible. Really bad.

I mean, you just don't need to pay into a Union to do that, do you?

Especially when work is getting more precarious and the cost of living means your wages don't go as far.

It's just a really great way to make people wonder what the point of joining a Union is.

Especially when a lot of people are experiencing worsening working conditions right now and experiencing a real mis-match between how hard they work and what they can then afford - and are wondering, 'Why is there no organisation that can help me re-adjust this? Surely this is what a trade Union movement is for?'

thecatfromjapan · 12/10/2021 12:16

@Bollockstothat

UCU are utterly fucking useless. Totally fucked any chance of taking on employers effectively on things like pensions devaluation by binning the idea of focused campaigns in favour of wanking on about 'four fights' - who the fuck thinks they can win on four fronts simultaneously? That level of stupidity should have automatically disqualified you from getting anywhere near a university job.

And in the middle of the biggest public health crisis the universities have ever faced, when staff are often being made to work in unsafe environments, they'd rather bang on about Israel and attack a lesbian academic.

UCU is functionally useless now. Time for a new union.

I think this is very important.

The UCU are pretty toothless on issues which are the 'traditional' job of unions.

We can probably trace it all the way back to Thatcher's reining in of Union power.

The UCU have been missing in action over the decimation of Further Education - and the impact of that on all those working in FE.

They may have been pretty hopeless with regards to HE - but workers there have masses more power and prestige than their FE colleagues - FE workers really, really needed a Union.

And the UCU really didn't/couldn't step up there. Partly as a result of being tied into changes in the law around what action unions can take, partly through being outmanoeuvred by changes in contemporary working conditions.

The UCU are left with symbolic gestures.

But it's madness.

Who needs to pay Union dues for symbolic gestures? You can do that for free, yourself, on Twitter. Or with a badge, or a t-shirt.

It's a depressing expression of futility.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 12/10/2021 12:13

In a statement 'in support of trans and nonbinary communities', sent to all members and posted online by Prof Stock, the union reps write: 'We extend our solidarity to all trans and nonbinary members of our community who, now more than ever, should receive the unequivocal support of the University and its management

Translation : In a statement sent to all members the union reps write: "We pledge to extend misogynistic ideology and practice to figuratively and literally fuck over all women in the name of patriarchy evermore. A-men".

JoodyBlue · 12/10/2021 12:09

I think we should start to take issue with the term transphobia. It is used as a silencing tool and I sometimes think that it is given far too credence. A fear is one thing, a hatred is another. The "be kind" mantra appealing to female socialisation and acceptance of others is pretty revealing that the majority of women don't participant in hatred. Fear on the other hand is entirely rational when it comes to men. Males are stronger than women and we know that sufficient male born people wish harm to women. Being afraid is rational. The easy banding about of the word transphobia is part of the control technique isn't it? It is really disgusting behaviour.

PostingForTheFirstTime · 12/10/2021 12:08

DM are on it
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10083077/Trans-community-blasts-bullies-trying-silence-feminist-lecturer.html

Strange times, when I regard DM as an ally.

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