Gender fluid confusion

I'm also autistic, and while I obviously have no problem with the standard commonplace use of singular they for a person of unknown ("someone left their umbrella") or unspecified ("no visitor should leave without their umbrella") sex, I have real problems using it once I know someone's sex, because it feels like lying. I experience extreme discomfort at having to speak counterfactually in front of people who know I'm speaking counterfactually. When it comes to comfort levels, you might as well tell me the correct pronoun to use for person A is a flash of my tits, and referring to them using anything other than a titflash will make them uncomfortable. What about my comfort?

I guess it doesn't help me that the term gender fluid makes me think of..

....any liquid secretion associated with one sex in particular. I can think of a few.

Hey, I don't like it anymore than you do. I said I'm a woman, I never claimed to be a lady.

I don’t think I’ll ever be able to unsee that.

I guess it doesn't help me that the term gender fluid makes me think of jizz. I'm sorry but I can't help it.

Not always surely though?

How about;

Person X "Earlier, Ann said that that the sky was purple".
Person A "No she didn't!"

"No, Ann didn't do that" sounds odd.

Or have been rude all my life?

I know that she is the cat's mother and can recognise instances where names should be used but there do seem to be instances where the third person singular is more appropriate.

I've decided that 'they' is the cat's father btw given cats' sexual behaviour.

I find 'they' awkward and jarring. It is also often ambiguous. It's also increasingly being used to stand in for actual names. Sometimes I think it is just lazy and sloppy writing.

Making other people feel comfortable is a two-way street. The 'gender fluid' person, if they are an adult, should be able to brush off any 'mistakes' made by other people, make them feel at ease, and gently explain if the other party seems interested.

Maybe the person who told you in advance that you 'have to' refer to the other person in a particular way is just being overly anxious and the 'gender fluid' person themselves would be mortified to know a fuss is being made on their behalf?

If the diktat did come from the 'gender fluid' person, they already sound like tedious company and you could be in for a very long, dull social occasion that will revolve around their 'journey' or tip-toeing around it to avoid a tantrum or sadface. Either way, the occasion would end up being all about them.

The only time I would appreciate knowing what topics or words to avoid when meeting someone for the first time, would be in the case of someone having recently miscarried or suffered the loss of a child. An adult should be robust enough to be able to deal gracefully with any other assumptions a well-intentioned acquaintance might make about them.

I guess in reality you would use both. The 'problem' with they is the sense you are obligated to use it in their absence. Talking with my DD about someone we both know, who is female but uses they is hard work. So amongst ourselves we use she. But know she prefers they. But I wouldn't call her she to someone else and neither would DD as her friends are mostly very 'kind' around pronouns and she would be in trouble for not respecting their pronouns.
Maybe linguistically it will feel less odd if it becomes more widespread. Although this would also mean more acceptance of gender ideology which I don't think is a good thing.

Why can't we use 'the person' or 'that person' rather than they/them if they don't want sex based pronouns?

MagpiePi walked out of MagpiePi's room wearing MagpiPi's favourite t-shirt and then MagpiePi called the garage to see if MagpiePi could get an appointment to get MagpiePi's car fixed...

It is mentally exhausting!

But obviously, someone else's gender validation or non-gender validation or whatever it is they need to be feel special, is the most important thing in any situation.

I find the problem arises if people make an issue of it (either way) and say 'they' with any sort of special emphasis, be it mocking or that twinkly 'ooh, aren't I good to have remembered' .... if anyone has seen star trek discovery I'm thinking of Stammers and the doctor, they can't just refer to the youngster naturally as 'they', it's totally cringeworthy.

mudday

I think in a social setting you’ll be fine to refer to them with their name

I doubt you’d be talking about them if they aren’t in your conversation group or have popped to the loo

And to be fair if i was in your situation I’d make an effort, but if i make a mistake i make a mistake

Welcome to the not-so-wonderful world of gender ideology, Mudday, where anyone can say they are anything and you are considered unkind and transphobic for failing to go along with their demands for you to change your language.

Language is really important. It changes thoughts and that's what this is all about. Gender ideology is all about getting us to stop thinking that sex is important and replacing it with gender. There are thousands of different genders, no one knows what any of them actually mean and of course the majority of us have no sense of gender at all, we're just women or men and that's it.

In the case of this person I'd say the minimum to them: 'Hello' and pass on. Deprive them of the attention and specialness they seek. If you have to talk to them you can call them by their name or 'you'.

Read Trans by Helen Joyce or anything by Abigail Shriver. If you want to dive deep into the murky depths of trans ideology, this is the thread to read:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

Once you've read those and know what you're talking about you will be prepared to take this issue head-on.

OP, you are getting an unfairly hard time here.
I am both autistic and a pedant. I would be completely unable to deny reality, mangle language, and use an inappropriate pronoun.
Let me pose a philosophical question.
Suppose your friend is hosting someone who firmly identifies as Napoleon.
Would you feel forced to be complicit in validating their identity and address them as “your imperial majesty”? If not, why not, and what is the difference? Why does one compel validation to be “nice” and the other does not?
Why is their comfort more important than yours? Why is it always women who have to concede space?

Just don't refer to them. Problem solved.

I find 'they' for a singular person jarring but I wouldn't make an issue of it with a specific person. It would be kind of rude to challenge this socially. Just use their name?

...or, I get this thought process when I I come across they/them for a single person:
'gosh, iare they are so overweight that they are the size of two people? You can't do that! You can't mention anyone's weight these days because it it's body shaming/ triggering etc,etc, etc.....'

I get you OP!! The use of they/them for a single person always makes me do a mental double take. It's like when their/there, your/you're lose/loose are used wrongly. I have to go back and re-read the sentence, and work out what was really meant and it means I am slightly irritated at the disruption in the flow.

Although, don't worry, I do know you are not allowed to pull anyone up on their misuse of homophones beacuse it is classist or educationalist or something.

What misunderstood person?

You mean the friend of a friend who you will meet at a social thing?

Are they misunderstood? The request was use they/ them. Hardly tricky.

If you feel this freaked out/ pissed off etc about doing that little thing for a friend of a friend then please. Don't go.

You don't know them right?

They might be really funny. Interesting. Charming and fun. Great company. They could be a person who you totally click with.

You want to go and be a dick and ruin the hosts night by essentially starting on their friend?

That's genuinely awful. Why would you do that? Don't get it at all.

When it comes to this topic, for me. It's zero to do with individuals. Most people are fine even lovely. Friend of a friend you will likely get on.

For me the issues are not about individuals. People. Who I take as I find.

It's about law, risk, the language changes IE women and girls essentially being called cunts. But on the next page. Women is used to mean sex. It's about stats, prisons. So so much. Already gone. How? Cunty types are being pushed back decades. Plus, no words to refer to the billions of us on the planet as a group. Ever. Even female is nearly gone.

We are fucked.

But that's not the fault of a friend of a friend.

Go and be nice.
Make excuse.

Don't be an arse.

If you are speaking to this person directly, you should be using the pronoun you as a form of address.

If you are speaking of this person within his or her hearing, you should be using his/her name anyway.

Fairly simple situation to avoid, just by abiding by pre-2000 etiquette. So I'd do that.