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Starker: Not only women have a cervix

314 replies

WildRunner · 26/09/2021 21:17

This has made me cross.

Labour conference: Not right to say only women have a cervix, says Starmer www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-58698406

I'm about to go for my smear test. Any man who feels like a woman is welcome to have a speculum inserted into his non-existent cervix - as long as it isn't at the expense of appointments for biological women.

OP posts:
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WarriorN · 27/09/2021 13:18

The Scottish Labour MP Ian Murray on Woman's Hour explained at length that there were people other than women that have a cervix. He said it's technical language!

Emma's faux "I don't understand what you've just said" was comedy gold Grin

Kittii · 27/09/2021 13:16

Thanks for the link to WH.

The thing is, even women and transmen isn't enough for some. What about non-binary and gender fluid people? And all the other 100+ genders there apparently are. If you're going to be inclusive don't you need to list all of these genders? Otherwise someone might get left out.

Fitt · 27/09/2021 13:16

The Scottish Labour MP Ian Murray on Woman's Hour explained at length that there were people other than women that have a cervix. He said it's technical language!

It's not technical, it's a belief. Listening to him, it's like hearing him earnestly say that technically Jesus is the son of God.

Hate the Tory "scum" if you like but they landed on the opposite side to these gullible fools on this subject.

WarriorN · 27/09/2021 12:49

Oooh Emma Im loving you more each week!

WarriorN · 27/09/2021 12:41

Helen Lewis was fabulous on WH 👍

WarriorN · 27/09/2021 12:40

Dammit I just confused Helen Lewis with Angela raynor - was thinking, bloody hell what's happened to Angela!

Nothing. Obvs. 🙄

Alekto · 27/09/2021 12:28

@Ereshkigalangcleg

You've missed my exact point, of course you are a woman there is no doubt in your mind and my mind that it does not change your gender.

She's a woman because of her female sexed body, that's the only reason. Not because she feels she is one. Having female body parts removed does not change your sex and literally no one here thinks it does. You are being ridiculous.

"Gender" is a social construct based on sex stereotypes. Sex is material reality.

Thank you. I was too angry to trust myself to reply to that person's mealy mouthed response to my post last night.

I don't have a 'gender identity', and believe all concepts of gender to be wholly based on harmful stereotypes. I am a woman because of my sexed body alone.

Floisme · 27/09/2021 12:21

@ErrolTheDragon

There are other forms of wording, e.g. 'women, including transmen' or 'women, irrespective of how they identify'

The first is unambiguous bit likely to be considered unacceptable to reality deniers. The second would be interpreted rationally by most people as 'all females' but as 'women, transwomen and pips Bunce on a Pippa day' by the genderists.

I am no longer concerned about what's acceptable to reality deniers but yes, good point about the second suggestion.
WarriorN · 27/09/2021 12:16

I'm holding Emma Barnett personally responsible for two weeks worth of poor Monday productivity now 🧐

Much to my delight...!

Floisme · 27/09/2021 12:16

or not

Floisme · 27/09/2021 12:16

@Feelingoktoday

'women, irrespective of how they identify'

But I’m not identifying!!! I am a women. My sex is a woman. I would never tick a box with that description.

That's why I suggested 'irrespective of....' - to include all women whether they have a gender identity of not.
WarriorN · 27/09/2021 12:15

Yes Curious, there's all this talk of "inclusivity" and use of language which both excludes a number of groups with "protected characteristics" through this obscure fuzzy language, and so also causes safeguarding issues.

So all this "why are you scared of inclusivity?" crap is actively going against safeguarding.

WarriorN · 27/09/2021 12:12

@LizzieSiddal

Emma Barnett on Women's Hour was very good. She also spoke to Helen Lewis, who was brilliant on this. It’s the first 15 minutes of Women’s Hour.
Fab, will listen now
CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/09/2021 11:12

Bugger, wish I'd proofed that ... sorry!

CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/09/2021 11:11

@Bollindger

Maybe they should write biological females, who need a test...
The idea is to make services based on biology simple ti understand for people owth liitedliteracy, different first language.

Women need cervical screening

Some women will not, most will know they do not, nobody loses out of some who do not enquire.

No man will. So why make the service less accessible placating the hurt feelings of thoe men who want to have one?

ArabellaScott · 27/09/2021 10:59

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

10.02 here, on Raynor's 'scum' comments and subsequently, I expect, Starmer - listening now!

LizzieSiddal · 27/09/2021 10:50

Emma Barnett on Women's Hour was very good. She also spoke to Helen Lewis, who was brilliant on this. It’s the first 15 minutes of Women’s Hour.

Gmom · 27/09/2021 10:43

Someone above has said "Why are people so threatened by inclusivity. It does not affect you at all."

This is naive. Re-defining the term "woman" such that it no longer correlates to female sex characteristics or avoiding the word "woman" altogether affects all women.

Abhannmor · 27/09/2021 10:43

If you can look me in the eye and say you cannot be absolutely certain which of your parents impregnated the other , of course I will respect your position. But I'm not going to vote for you.

Bollindger · 27/09/2021 10:41

Maybe they should write biological females, who need a test...

Ekofisk · 27/09/2021 10:27

@Ekofisk

Going to be talking about this on BBC Woman's Hour now - it's Emma Barnett presenting.
Emma Barnett quizzing the Labour Scottish shadow minister on Starmer's comments - well worth a listen.
DottyHarmer · 27/09/2021 10:18

I agree with @WarriorN - this could be dangerous as a good few women wouldn’t understand they were being called for a smear test, say, if it was a call to “people with a cervix” .

Perhaps this will extend to having to invite everyone for a smear test so as not to offend anyone. I can’t imagine fil, say, knowing whether he had a cervix or not.

HelloMissus · 27/09/2021 10:09

Why don’t they just say women and trans men?
Or women and trans people?

Why get rid of the vast vast majority of folk with a cervix?

Shedbuilder · 27/09/2021 10:09

I'm not remotely alienated by the term 'individuals with a cervix' because I am an individual with a cervix. It's inclusive.

Inclusivity is used as a weapon to destroy lesbian and women-only spaces. Inclusivity is used as an argument to coerce lesbians into sleeping with transwomen. The demand for inclusivity has destroyed women-only and lesbian-only space. Inclusivity is misogynistic.

It took a while because most of us here are reasonable progressive people. But we finally cottoned on to the fact that 'inclusivity' is dangerous to women and girls.

RufustheBadgeringReindeer · 27/09/2021 10:08

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Worth noting that the evidence of violence by trans women in women's spaces is far less than the evidence of violence against trans women in men's spaces.

Yes, you're absolutely right @ozzyteabiscuit.

I'm not sure they are. Citation please.

Yes id quite like some evidence either way
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