Page 6 | Starmer on Marr now

Jaysmith71 · 2021-09-26T08:47:29+00:00

We must have a tolerent debate.... Trans community are the most marginalised community of all ....and 'Only women have a cervix' is, "Something that should not be said."

Original poster

Jaysmith71 · 26/09/2021 17:39

#cwen4leader

Under the Electoral College system I've just made up, my two million votes also go to Cwen.

OP posts:

Violetparis · 26/09/2021 17:37

I am genuinely sad about this too, have always voted Labour and been a member. I'm at the point of giving up on them which is something I never thought I would say.
Hoping I can vote Green depending on the leadership election outcome. The Tory party are going to use this issue to hammer and ridicule Labour and who can blame them.

Fitt · 26/09/2021 17:35

#cwen4leader

10 votes from me.

BraveBananaBadge · 26/09/2021 17:34

Something of a cross post and think you explained it better Spindle!

Original poster

Jaysmith71 · 26/09/2021 17:33

@averylongtimeago

I have voted Labour all my life. I can clearly remember the feeling of joy when Tony Blair won in 1997, the relief that the tories had finally gone.

And yet here we are. I cannot vote for a party that chooses to act as if half the population are less than human, so that we can't even name ourselves let alone have rights.

The best I can hope for is that the Brexit mess and covid cock up and corruption mean the grownups in the Tory party take back control from the shower of shite currently in charge.
I might not have liked Maggie, but at least her government was halfway competent. Anyone suggesting women could have a penis to Thatcher would have very swiftly been dealt with!

averylongtimeago

I cannot share your faith in Thatcher who indulged Saville and trusted Peter Morrison with her (failed) leadership campaign in 1990.

OP posts:

SpindleWorld · 26/09/2021 17:33

India Willoughby has previously called themselves a 'cis woman'; presumably because India has had surgery affecting the genito-urinary / secondary sex organs? I think that if the 'neo organs' are made from penile tissue that may have had exposure to GOV - which is common in adults, in the UK - then checks are advised, and sensible. These are not actually cervical smears as such, though - they're HPV tests.

So there's a kind of psychological medico-legal fiction going on there.

BraveBananaBadge · 26/09/2021 17:31

@Cwenthryth

India believes India has a cervix? The mind boggles!

But but…..if India believes India is a woman, and India believes India has a cervix, why does India have a problem with the statement “women have a cervix”?!?!

I'm guessing, and being generous, that India will still need regular checks of that area for cancer in the cells it is comprised of. To call it a literal cervix is quite something though.

And I'm sure India knows there are many trans women who have gone through no such procedure and never will. That's a completely separate issue and she is being extremely disingenuous here by trying to claim all trans women are in her boat.

averylongtimeago · 26/09/2021 17:28

I have voted Labour all my life. I can clearly remember the feeling of joy when Tony Blair won in 1997, the relief that the tories had finally gone.

And yet here we are. I cannot vote for a party that chooses to act as if half the population are less than human, so that we can't even name ourselves let alone have rights.

The best I can hope for is that the Brexit mess and covid cock up and corruption mean the grownups in the Tory party take back control from the shower of shite currently in charge.
I might not have liked Maggie, but at least her government was halfway competent. Anyone suggesting women could have a penis to Thatcher would have very swiftly been dealt with!

Newnewnew1179 · 26/09/2021 17:24

@Floisme

I think there's a certain amount of grasping at straws going on, I don't say that to be rude; Starmer has clearly picked his side and we're not it. You're not being rude, you are absolutely correct and I am guilty as charged.

I agree, me too. I had hoped, for political reasons if nothing else, there’d be a far more conciliatory response from Starmer today maybe along the lines of something **Cwen so eloquently said - but no

. His reference to changing the law is very concerning and he needs to be asked to explain what he means by that in some detail.

I just cannot believe that in a week where we have had queues at petrol stations, energy bills set to rocket, prospect of food shortages etc etc the Sunday news is dominated by Keir Starmer saying that it is wrong to say only women have a cervix and Angela Raynor describing people as scum because of their politics. I’d like some grown ups to take over please.

DdraigGoch · 26/09/2021 17:21

@Thingybob

Just discussed this with a reasonably intelligent married man, educated to degree level and works at a professional level. His response was "what's a cervix? If he doesn't know how are we supposed to educate children without using the word woman?

I'd like to bet that many men don't know that a cervix is part of the female reproductive system. Fewer will know its function. Quite a lot of women are probably in the same boat. For that reason, I doubt that Starmer's interview will have a wide impact.

On the other hand, there won't be many adults around who don't know what a vagina is, so if he tried to claim that 'men have vaginas too', 90% of viewers would have a tea-keyboard incident.

FOJN · 26/09/2021 17:21

Alekto

Hope it works, I'm wrangling with a new tablet!

DdraigGoch · 26/09/2021 17:15

@BaronessWrongCrowd

Can someone please explain to me how the ‘Trans community are the most marginalised community of all.’

From where I stand this ‘community’ has the ear of and funding from governments, political parties, major institutions, schools, big businesses, charities, the police, healthcare, big tech - social media. Laws are in the process and have been changed, mainly at the detriment of other groups. That doesn’t exactly sound marginalised to me.

I don’t believe for one second that the majority of transpeople agree with what is being demanded/done in their name. Why doesn’t Starmer listen to them? Why do the Labour Party not listen and just repeat false narratives?

Anyway. I will not vote for Labour ever again.
I’m hoping that Shahar Ali wins the leadership election for the Greens because at least I will be able to cast a vote and not spoil it like last time.

“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less.” “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” “The question is,” said Humpty Dumpty, “which is to be master—that's all.”

RoyalCorgi · 26/09/2021 17:15

I can't take the stupidity any longer. I'm going to explode.

Datun · 26/09/2021 17:13

The "not right" was where Marr cut him off. He continues by saying "Oh, Andrew, I don’t think that we can just go through various things that people have said"

The entire question was about the misogynistic threats that Rosie Duffield has received, and the fact that it's too dangerous for her to go to conference, because of what she said.

Strewth. Talk about the stereotypical politician's answer, of not addressing the issue.

Cwenthryth · 26/09/2021 17:12

India believes India has a cervix? The mind boggles!

But but…..if India believes India is a woman, and India believes India has a cervix, why does India have a problem with the statement “women have a cervix”?!?!

OldCrone · 26/09/2021 17:07

This is India's tweet Alekto

I have a cervix. Get checked by the NHS every few years. Demeaning talking about it @AndrewMarr9. You absolutely know this a work-around way of calling women who are T men, leading into all the other bigotry. #Marr

Perhaps India believes that India also has a uterus.

VortexofBloggery · 26/09/2021 17:05

He's a TRA. No woman can trust a man who denies her biological reality. He clearly hates having to support women has no intention of saying the word "woman" in relation to a cervix or any other aspect of our unique biology, and only wants to talk exclusively about men's rights to women's spaces. He is showing us who he is, believe him.

Alekto · 26/09/2021 17:03

[quote FOJN]This is erm.... educational!

twitter.com/IndiaWilloughby/status/1442084962954481668?s=20[/quote]

Any chance of a screenshot for the blocked?

Fbpes · 26/09/2021 17:03

@littlbrowndog

It’s not trans issues

It’s women’s rights

🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️🤦‍♀️

Emmm. Well it’s not that simple is it? What happens when the rights of one group clashes with the wishes of another? In centre left politics they usually side with the smaller group because small vulnerable groups generally need the protection more than a group that’s 51% of the population. This is just left wing politics 101 which is why trans rights is supported by every single centre left party. Feminists tend to vote for these parties and get what they vote for. Kier Stammer is just saying what I would expect any Labour leader to say.

Ideas like the wishes of the majority coming first are things that tend to be found of the centre right.

Floisme · 26/09/2021 16:57

I think there's a certain amount of grasping at straws going on, I don't say that to be rude; Starmer has clearly picked his side and we're not it.
You're not being rude, you are absolutely correct and I am guilty as charged.

FOJN · 26/09/2021 16:48

This is erm.... educational!

twitter.com/IndiaWilloughby/status/1442084962954481668?s=20

JustSpeculation · 26/09/2021 16:47

How hard would it have been to answer something like:......

It seems very hard, which suggests there is a real climate of fear in the party.

TooWicked · 26/09/2021 16:45

@Cwenthryth that’s a perfect answer, have you ever thought of going into politics? I’d vote for you #cwen4leader

Alekto · 26/09/2021 16:44

#CwenForLeader

You'd have my vote!

FlyingOink · 26/09/2021 16:43

It's genuinely sad to see how upset some Labour voters and ex-Labour voters are about this, on this thread and elsewhere. I think there's a certain amount of grasping at straws going on, I don't say that to be rude; Starmer has clearly picked his side and we're not it.

I can see why some people will never vote Tory, and I respect that, that was me for many years. But if the Tories row back on some of the damage that has been done and state women are adult human females instead of some mysterious essence of femininity or indeed just a feeling in a man's head then I'll vote for them. And I won't feel guilty, because Labour are intentionally making themselves unelectable and therefore unable to help vulnerable people.

If Starmer really wanted to get into power and change lives for the better he would avoid alienating women. Of course then once in power he could sell us all down the river, but he's not going to get into power if he carries on like this, no matter what Boris does in the meantime.