How to approach the 'TW in a work loo' issue

In all honesty if I transitioned at work I would use the accessible if there was one because it would be bleeding obvious that my make colleagues would not feel comfy me wandering in while they were taking a piss.

How this simple basic understanding of perfectly obvious things is ignored/ labelled bigoted etc is beyond me.

Not males. Their gender is female
Are you late to this debate or have you been out of it for a while?
Its come to pass officially that sex is definitely not the same as gender, therefore a female gender means Jack.
And just in case you were away longer still, the mantra born in the wrong body is also 'gasp' untrue.
Just so you dont embarrass yourself any more.

'Not males. Their gender is female. They have just as much right to use the female toilets as any other female. Criticising someones physical appearance when they are probably trying their best NOT to traumatise anyone is just bigotry.'

Female and male are sex terms. What are your terms for sex if the existing ones all mean internal gender id to you?

Plus

There's a unisex accessible toilet. Yes it's not good to use if you don't need but assuming OPs workplace is like mine have been they are are there to meet legal requirements and in practice used in general by people who are in a situation where they'd like a bit of extra privacy. Why wouldn't this person use that, if concerned about making anyone uncomfortable (traumatised is a pretty major thing let's stick with uncomfortable).

How come the transwoman's desire to use the women's space matters more than the woman's desire for a single sex space?

Its almost like you're saying one sex matters more than the other (Whatever anyone's feelings about their 'gender')

Have they scanned large random groups and found how many people are transgender in their brains?

Apparently 'studies have been done' which show that trans people have brains more similar with the 'gender they identify with'. However, funnily enough these studies always come with the disclaimer that this doesn't apply to all trans people and that even if a trans woman's brain just looks like any other male brain then that doesn't mean they are not trans.

So it's all very robust and scientific

Not males. Their gender is female. They have just as much right to use the female toilets as any other female.

Their biological sex is male, their physiology is male, their chromosomal make up is male. Their gender identity may be female but their sex remains unaltered. I reserve the right not to share toilets or other facilities where I may be undressed or vulnerable with a male.

So what happens if all the women in the office now decide to use the disabled toilet instead?

The minority actually disabled have their own access restricted due to in being in constant use by the women.

HR now have a headache on their hands when the disabled members of staff complain their isn't adequate provision for them and threaten a discrimination suit (hypothetically).

How does that play out then?

sex-matters.org/where-sex-matters/the-workplace/

Not males. Their gender is female. They have just as much right to use the female toilets as any other female.

What is a 'female gender'? What does that mean, what does it involve?

When did they gain the right to use the female toilets? When they just decided that they want to?

I'm very pleased to see the idea that women and men have different sorts of brains in some way is still going. And that they have finally found a way to prove it!

The women's brains are different has been used in the past to deny us the vote, positions in government, studying certain subjects, being expected to be predisposed to caring responsibilities etc. And plenty more I'm sure.

Have they scanned large random groups and found how many people are transgender in their brains? It would be really interesting to do it in an area where people haven't heard of the context.

Can it identity genders outside the binary?

This is huge news. Depending on which parts of the brain show a female brain. I have concerns about it being used against us as the idea of our brains being different has led to stuff in the past like but being allowed to be MPs and plenty more.

I think we should have another thread, alpha? This is fascinating. I've not seen it on the news.

sex-matters.org/posts/updates/sex-and-gender-belief-and-agnosticism-after-forstater/

(if they're getting hormones via the NHS, they have to get a brain scan to see if they have a womens brain inside a guys body)

That’s nonsense.

They all have to file past Layla Moran while she checks their souls.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/this-mp-has-summed-up-everything-wrong-with-the-transgender-debate/amp

Does anybody have any suggestions? I was thinking something very simple like:
'Please can you clarify our policy on which toilets, changing rooms and showers our transgender staff are expected to use?'

The policy will just be "Use the facilities for the gender you identify with", so that would be a waste of time.

have a look at sex matters the website/group set up by maya forraster. interesting legal exploration on there
one thing that springs to mind: what type of risk assessment have HR undertaken to allow male bodied, trans women into female single sex toilets? There was a judicial review recently taken against the government regarding trans identifying sex offenders in prisons. the case did not succeed in the sense that the court/judges decided there was sufficient safeguarding in women’s prisons such as to avoid a breach of human rights of the female inmates ( despite one of the judges accepting the rate of risk was 5 to 6 times greater from trans sex offenders to fellow prisoners, they said the sample group was too small, so happy to allow it to continue)
however one thing that came through from this and other cases ( to me) was each authority or organisation should be shown to have taken necessary steps to keep people safe. given single sex toilets exist for a reason, ang given the disproportionate rate of male on female defo sexual violence, surely there is a health and safety argument

And how privileged of you to just completely ignore the needs of the many women who cannot use a mixed-sex space for cultural, religious, ethnic or psychological reasons.

On what basis does this male get to use the ladies toilets? Because they feel like they should be able to? That's all this is isn't it, that's what it boils down to?

And women are not allowed to say no.

What's your deal? If they identify as a woman (if they're getting hormones via the NHS, they have to get a brain scan to see if they have a womens brain inside a guys body), then leave them be. This may not be one of your thoughts on trans women, but GCs calling all trans women rapists and that's fine, so by that logic, aren't all GCs rapists?

Wuh?

NotFrozen, have you seen any of the polls asking what loos transwomen should use? It's very much not the view of most people that women should budge up and allow males to do as they please. Most people understand the need for single sex spaces; hence the law to protect them.

And I just do not get why this person wouldn't use the mixed sex accessible toilet.

I mean they must know that it's a big change and even if all women are aok that it's a big change and they might feel uncomfy for a while.

So even in best case scenario it would be obvious that leaving a bit of time before hitting the ladies would be better for everyone.

This is the funniest thing I've read today. Well done.

@NotFrozen in what way is she transphobic? I can’t see where she’s expressed a fear or hatred of transphobic people - perhaps you could enlighten me?