Christine Mboma wins Diamond League 200m

Theeyeballsinthesky

Sean Ingle could be a bit more accurate though, because Caster Semenya holds the World 600m record of 1:21.77 set in 2017 in Berlin.
This has gone beyond wrong, it is actually pathetic.
Niyonsaba now holds all Burundian records from 400m to 10000m.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francine_Niyonsaba

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caster_Semenya

Notice the cropping in that clip!

And I also believe that they said, I could do pole vault, I can do anything. Running is about training, nothing else...

This is such horseshit. Men who do men's shot put can just switch to becoming male 100m runners with a bit of training, can they? The only way you can switch from long distance to sprint to field like this, without the years and years of technique training and competing in that event, is if you are a male competing against females and using your male power, fuelled by a male puberty and male levels of testosterone, to make up for lack of skill and experience.

I believe Niyonsaba has already said that they will move to the marathon if they are forced to change distance, will not stop running, aim to retire with a gold medal. And I also believe that they said, I could do pole vault, I can do anything. Running is about training, nothing else...

The onus should be on them to prove that they do not have 46XY chromosomes. This protects the majority of females. If there are 46XY DSD that have not gone through male puberty, an exception could be considered for them.... maybe..

The damage is already done.. very soon all of the women's records between 100m and 10,000m will be set by 46XY DSD athletes who are legally female.

How long will it take to * the records, never mind remind them from the record books?

www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/sep/14/francine-niyonsaba-becomes-first-athlete-with-dsd-to-break-world-record-2000m-athletics-zagreb

So glad Sean ingle keeps on with this

It is remarkable that when you look at photos of Niyonsoba, she not only has a pronounced Adam's apple, but a bulge in her shorts as well. In an era when female runners are basically wearing bathing suit bottoms, it is hard to miss.

The males can have their completely normal range testosterone for that race can't they? It is just for some others they have to temporarily reduce it to slightly lower levels (still way above women). As a fair compromise, not.

So, any bloke could have competed there and it would have been deemed a fair competition for women.

It is mainly men who govern these bodies and form these policies, isn't it? They must be pissing themselves laughing at what the way they are treating women athletes.

I wouldn't rise to any posters pretending they are concerned with race. That is to camouflage the fact they are only cheering males above females. Bet it was fine with then when Hubbard got on the women's ticket. Pretending it is any other reason than a male is competing against women in women's sports.

In 2019, Dina Asher Smith was Britain's golden girl. Taking the World Athletics 200m title (after the Jamaican and American sprinters had reigned supreme for years), sweeping the board the previous year with 3 golds at the Europeans. The British press were falling over themselves to heap praise on her. I never thought I would see the day when our callow, useless journalistic community can bare raise a murmur to our own big star being beaten (to a pulp in sprinting terms) by a biological male with zero form at the art of 200m running, but who simply powers through using male physical advantage.

Honestly, I feel utter despair this week. I have a daughter who is hoping to compete for her country one day. I just wonder how sick to the stomach DAS and her family feel watching her get beaten by this individual. All those years of training and sacrifice, to expect to be able to compete, win or lose fair and square. But who now would push their daughter out to compete on this ridiculously uneven playing field?

And fuck off to the race baiters on this thread. I'm not white. I don't care about the colour, race or nationality of these XY DSD athletes. I care that women and girls are being used to compensate for incompetent healthcare systems and corrupt sporting bodies. I know cheating when I see it, even when it's officially sanctioned cheating.

It's a joke now really. I see the alleged connection of the previous holder with a coach Jama Aden. Aden was arrested in 2016 for having EPO in his hotel room. Genzebe Dibaba has now distanced herself from that coach. Mo Farah had some alleged connections with Aden also. Farah has dismissed those allegations and has stated his connection was less that what was alleged.

Well, it's hard to judge women athletes for anything anymore. Not when male bodies are allowed to compete against them, complete with male testosterone etc. etc. etc. They are putting women at an automatic disadvantage in their supposed sex class competition. Males are naturally manufacturing testosterone at rates women don't. I don't know if even women doping with artificial testosterone would have the levels which the males who are allowed to compete against them have.

Tonight in Zagreb Francine Niyonsaba broke the women's world record for 2,000 metres running 5.21.56

Although not the most regularly run distance, worth noting that the previous quickest time was 5.23.75 by former 1,500m Olympic silver medalist and World Championship gold medalist Genzebe Dibaba of Ethiopia.

I still think he could have quoted from the CAS judgement and used the terms legally female and 'having gone though male puberty. '

It's a good although not perfect article. E.g. noting that some people's argument is based on the idea that "society is becoming more gender-fluid" but failing to highlight that boring old biological sex is just the same as it always has been. I think a lot of the confusion in this space comes from the conflation of gender and sex and articles like this need to do a better job of setting the scene on this before wading into the arguments. It was good that he was so unambiguous about the condition under question being a male (XY) DSD though.

Kudos to Sean Ingle. I wish more sports journalists would be this honest when discussing Mboma.

Yes, he laid out the problem quite well despite misleading title. His conclusion quoting CAS is spot on

Put simply, on one hand is the right of every athlete to compete in sport, to have their legal sex and gender identity respected, and to be free from any form of discrimination,” it said. "On the other hand, is the right of female athletes, who are relevantly biologically disadvantaged vis-à-vis male athletes, to be able to compete against other female athletes and to achieve the benefits of athletic success.”

Sophocles, it's just lazy and an attempt to stop the conversation through facile dogwhistle insults, "racist" and "bigot".

Totally agree Sophocles

I’m at a loss as to how it can be spun as racist that we are not supportive of two black women being denied their rightful placing and prize money by a male bodied athlete with a DSD.

Really, what is the point that you feel you’re making, here?

As a PP pointed out, in a different case, users of this board were also extremely upset and indignant on behalf of the women of colour from poor backgrounds in developing countries denied their time to shine and their place on the podium by Laurel Hubbard.

Here, for example: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/a4237143-Laurel-Hubbard-to-go-to-Tokyo?msgid=108419209#108419209

I presume that you’re equating this situation to the horrible comments that some people make about the supposed “masculinity” of black women athletes, like Serena Williams being called a man? I’ve never seen anyone do that on this board, and it would be squashed at once if anyone did, because it is disgustingly racist.

It is not abusive or racist to comment on the fact that, given these athletes are covered by the rules for 46XY DSD athletes, they must, in fact have a male physiology, with all the advantages thereto. It is completely dishonest and disingenuous to suggest that this is in any way motivated by racism, and suggests that you don’t want to discuss the actual issue at hand.

Crap, 'tomorrow' should be 'to'