Why do some men hate women?

Why is he blaming his mother for his failings in life ; where is his father?

It really shows the difference in socialisation. A woman in her twenties who was a virgin and didn't want to be would likely turn everything inward and think there was something wrong with her own appearance, personality or behaviour, whether or not it was true. But if a man in his twenties is a virgin he thinks it's all the evil women's fault for not having sex with him

Exactly! In general, men over-estimate their attractiveness and abilities and women under-estimate theirs. This was perfectly demonstrated by a discussion some years ago on R4 about men who repeatedly try to engage with women who’re wearing earphones on public transport. The man said: “I’d be flattered if a hot woman kept tapping me on the arm”. He automatically over-valued himself where, in reality, the comparison would be if a woman he didn’t find at all attractive kept trying to engage him.

The seething resentment of women some men exhibit is shocking. I think it’s a spectrum, with incels at one end. But it’s not all about sex IMO. Even gay men can be seething misogynists. For them, women have thwarted them in different ways.

I think the answer, as mentioned above, is that some men don’t see women as fully human. They see us as inferior and so the idea we might reject them in whatever way is seen as outrageous and humiliating, and increases their anger.

Incels are just men whose level of anger at women and inability to interact with them as equals is ramped up to a high level.

Vanessa Kinsul's thread addressing:

the disparity in how certain boys deal with the loneliness and social exclusion that SO MANY experience is deeply troubling to me.

archive of thread: archive.is/RmCqh

twitter.com/Vanessa_Kisuule/status/1426177456684273665

Her original thread she quote tweets:

I find it interesting that ‘incel’ has become synonymous with angry boys who think they are owed sex when the incel term, and community, were initially pioneered by a woman for ALL genders who lamented a lack of sex/romance in their lives.
…
It is straight white boys, who are taught that the world is theirs, that cannot handle the world’s disdain or, shock horror, its indifference. But to them I say, welcome.…‘The unwanted’ is a club replete with members. These boys don’t want love, btw. They want status. If you read their online diatribes, they're obsessed with obtaining the attentions of hot, skinny, Aryan bombshells - retrograde archetypes straight out of 2005. They want the associative gravitas. The woman herself is collateral

archive of thread: archive.ph/mEsK5

twitter.com/Vanessa_Kisuule/status/1372267558301229057

Sectioning is removing people from society that are a danger to themselves or the public.

Obviously I don’t mean section everyone in the forums, that’s just stupid, it’s a figure of speech, did you really not know that, or was you just being funny? Do you want me to laugh?

Deep rooted misogyny. Tale as old as time. This generation have grown up on porn being instantly available, normalised. I'm not surprised at this incel movement at all. It's just an extreme form of very common feelings and behaviours of a lot of men and society in general.

If I was a Christian, I'd say these were the definite end times

But i have to say they are fed the same media shit as us... A woman is thin, with clear skin, beautiful hair...dresses so well. Kind, clever. No baggage.
They wont get that because it doesnt exist.

Good point, when I was younger (& had a great figure) I would always be insecure before a beach holiday thinking everyone would be supermodels. Of course you get there & realise the vast majority don't look like supermodels.

I think men really just don't view women as fully human with a right to full autonomy.

This is completely unscientific but also, I wonder if they're just a bit more stuck in our evolutionary past, the y chromosome is so small it has very little ability to shuffle information an evolve without becoming non-functional.
They're just possessive, insecure, sexually driven apes in a way we aren't. This still wouldn't hold them back if they truly realised women didn't deserve their behaviour though.

They buy into media shit. Then are dissatisfied that they can't get what is expected. Its no excuse.

Yes - and the porn ideal of a woman is a big part of that.

I agree that's its entitlement.
But i have to say they are fed the same media shit as us... A woman is thin, with clear skin, beautiful hair...dresses so well. Kind, clever. No baggage.
They wont get that because it doesnt exist.

We know the media tells a false story.
These men dont see that. They think that women should all be perfect.

So a lovely woman talks to them, may have an interest in him.
But she isn't a supermodel.
He will reject. Because he deserves a model...

They buy into media shit.
Then are dissatisfied that they can't get what is expected.
Its no excuse.
Where the entitlement comes from... Thats the problem.

I think the men who hate women exhibit behaviour like this, I also think that there are a lot of women who hate men and exhibit equally toxic but very different behaviours - manipulative and not violent. I think quite a few men and women feed off this poisonous dynamic in both directions. It is very sad and depressing. It is getting worse and worse.

This actually drags up a lot of memories for me that I can't quite articulate, but it basically involves loud, narcissistic, misogynistic men holding court, never letting a woman get a word in edgewise, but being totally excused this behaviour because they smile and laugh a lot, and are fairly kind to their wife while she's running around waiting on them hand and foot.

They blame women as they have massive insecurities. It is always easier to blame someone else or an entire group of people rather than be brutally honest with yourself and really look within take ownership and fix yourself/your issue. I am sure there are many more men who think like that evil man but keep it quiet or post it anonymously online. We need to bring up our girls confidently to hold their ground and bring up our boys to be respectful and open minded in views and open minded to self change.

It's a sense of entitlement. They feel entitled not only to sex but to sex with young women who meet their (usually very exacting) standard of attractiveness.

In their world, women can get sex any time they like, even the "old" and "ugly" ones. We are the "gatekeepers" and treat the poor menz who aren't total alphas like crap, because we have so much power.

I’m getting older and the attractiveness of youth has long left me behind. It’s possibly true that I could get sex, but I have little interest in sex for its own sake and definitely have no interest is sex with someone I don’t find attractive. This utter value placed on “getting sex” is a bizarre concept to me.

I also feel a double standard is being applied here. I could get sex, but would have to be unfussy over who it was with. I can’t imagine that a young, not unattractive man like the recent Plymouth killer couldn’t have got sex with someone, but he probably wants more than just sex with any old woman. He probably could have got a girlfriend, had he bothered to get out from obsessing behind his computer and gone out and made an effort see women as human beings and not evil bitches who were determined to thwart him. He even said that he’d had plenty of interest from girls at school. It sounds like these young men sit on their computers and obsess over things that would likely actually be solved by getting out into the world and meeting people.

Even in middle age I am still surprised by men I know who don't like women speaking their own mind! I was at an extended family BBQ recently and the alpha male was dominating the conversations and belittling women in various 'humourous' ways. One of the women cut him down with a quick witted comment, and everyone laughed, at him and I swear the look on his face, a quick flash of hatred, before he fumbled around for some lame comeback.

His own wife at one point laughed at some thing he said and just mumbled 'its easier to go along with him'. 🙄 my own DM is similar with my DF, anything for an easy life! 'Oh you know what your dads like... it's easier not to argue'. Fuck. That. Shit. Will all of them!

Same men and others are often, victim blames and rape apologists!

Male entitlement, which has it's roots in every aspect of our society. Their reaction to being "denied" sex and adoration is anger.

I do think subconsciously there's still a lot of thinking around that suggests that women aren't really people.

Also, with the messages given by the media and upbringing some guys confuse 'wanting to fuck women' with 'liking women' and are all 'hey, I love women!' when they don't actually regard them as full human beings.

Currently we are negotiating a period of women emerging from being chattel (yes, still) and some men have difficulty dealing with that, so rather than being productive and thinking of how they can be better people, they translate it into hating women.

@76FDre421 I agree that many men are threatened by the fact that women can leave independent lives.

I worry that a lot of men feel this way about women, but most of them reluctantly adhere to social norms because it makes a nice easy life for them, not because they actually believe that women are equal or even worthy of respect. You only have to look at the way so many "normal, respectable" men talk and behave in male spaces, "locker room talk" etc.

These "incels" are just one branch, who probably lack the social skills to "play the game". We all know that most men who have a total contempt for women do manage to find multiple partners, often through a very calculated, manipulative love bombing phase. And then proceed make their lives a living hell.

Ps I do of course know a large number of genuinely decent men. But I also know a large number who are not, and who I believe would be vulnerable to this kind of radicalisation, or who at least would quickly become emboldened in expressing their true beliefs with just a small shift in social norms.

[quote EmbarrassingAdmissions]Jane Clare Jones' Twitter thread on a relevant discussion:

archive.is/YvHj7[/quote]
Adding a review of the upcoming (Aug 19) publication of Does Anyone Have the Right to Sex? (essay was published in LRB in 2018):

These events inspired Amia Srinivasan to write an essay, Does Anyone Have the Right to Sex?, published in the London Review of Books, that caused quite a stir. Rodger, she argued, raised an issue we needed to tackle. There had, she said, been plenty of feminist commentary on “the incel phenomenon” (short for “involuntary celibate”) and “male sexual entitlement, objectification and violence”. Yet there hadn’t been nearly so much on the “ideological shaping” of desire. Whose bodies, she asks, “confer status on those who have sex with them”? And what do we do about the racism, ableism and transphobia that “makes its way into the bedroom through the seemingly innocuous mechanism of ‘personal preference’”?

The Right to Sex by Amia Srinivasan review — when did intimacy become such a minefield?
The confusing world of desire is put under the microscope by a controversial writer

archive: archive.is/OjtAt

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-right-to-sex-by-amia-srinivasan-review-3d9njsrqb