#AskRapeCrisisScotland

This isn’t about how somebody chooses to live, (how can anyone know how a stranger chooses to live?). It is about sex. That is all.

If a woman cannot demand a woman practitioner or space - then who is saying ‘no’? Who is telling her that she can’t? Why can 51% of the population be told no by the other 49%? How is this so? Why is she attacked for this and told that her feelings (as a victim) is trumped by someone who can never understand how she is feeling?

Lurkermum we KNOW already that NATWALT. But the fact is this stupid, dangerous ideology is being pushed like mad across the world so that abusive, woman hating men like MW can dominate women, access the spaces and bodies of women and children, profit from self loathing and strip our remaining rights away. It matters nought if a few individuals are peace loving and private. The hordes of abusive men and the ridiculous, treacherous women who push this crap far outnumber these people and let's not pretend otherwise.

I saw someone pointing out the masculinity of the CEO -using a photo - which is unfair if they choose to live as a woman. Regardless of my beliefs or yours people are free to transition and if they choose too I think they should be able to live safely and with a level of acceptance . Much as I hope too- As a non trans person. A woman.from a non white background.
Maybe that’s why I am sensitive to what I see are comments beside the point. One bad egg does not make everyone the same. Not all trans folk are radical lunatics ( there are many ) who choose to live as they do and hope for a happy and fulfilled safe life … I think the anger I see and the awful comments make others unsafe who deserve to be safe . I think this is awful.

Women can be angry. It's not awful to be angry. In many cases, it's justified. When so many women are raped, sexually abused, that it's commonplace, I think its healthy to be angry.

I agree completely that everyone should be safe, and free to dress how they please, and live how they please, and love/have sex with any consenting adult who'll have them.

I am happy to live alongside men (and transwomen) in almost all situations, but there are some spaces, places and situations that I want a woman-only space. That's all.

Trans rights are human rights, absolutely. Trans people deserve all the same support, protection and respect as everyone else. I don't think you'll find many women here disagreeing, tbh.

Someone upthread asked if there were any single sex rape crisis centres in Scotland.
Women and Girls Scotland are actively trying to establish this.At present it would seem no for Dundee and a yes for Clackmannanshire.

wgscotland.org.uk/

I see these arguments come up again and again - 'NAMALT, Mumsnet is so transphobic, you're accusing all transpeople of being predators, you're all so mean, why can't we all just be kind?'

Despite a heavy push from TRA's to reframe these discussions as 'anti-trans', it is not. It is pro woman. Women fighting to keep their established, legal single sex spaces.

Transpeople should be free to live their lives safe from discrimination and threats, be able to present how they like, wear what they like, live their best lives. But they shouldn't be able to access single sex spaces (however nice they are) because those are spaces for women and girls, for their safety and dignity.

But women pointing out this seemingly uncontroversial point are called violent slurs, told to 'die in a grease fire' and that they will get raped. It might be a minority of violent TRA's but they are very vocal and have established the chilling effect in society. The cry of 'transphobe!' has been very effective.

This is one of the only places women can discuss this and even this has to be anonymous. Generally, considered and well evidenced arguments regarding women's right. There is anger but very rarely actual transphobia. And even here, we are monitored, deleted and told to 'be kind'.

If I were a vastly rich care-free celebrity I'd announce that I were setting up female-only DV/rape refuges just over the English side of the border and providing free transport to/from major Scottish cities for women. For good measure, I'd also set up specialist transmen & transwomen facilities so everyone has a safe place to go when in need.

MW is a liar with an agenda, and that agenda does not include any tolerance and understanding for women in distress. I'm not interested in being tolerant towards someone who disparages women.

Neither am I. Nor am I interested in being told to be nicer, kinder and more accepting of folk who have no intention of reciprocating.

Others may be happy to bend the knee, that's their choice, meanwhile the rest of us will not comply.

#NoThankYou
#WomenWontWheest

Lurkermum - "I saw someone pointing out the masculinity of the CEO -using a photo - which is unfair if they choose to live as a woman."

I read that differently. This person has taken a job which means they are in direct contact with women who have been traumatised and violated by men.

So, MW's appearance is relevant to those women. Trauma is not polite or politically correct. Why can we not focus on the needs of the women?

Why does MW's feelings matter more than those of the women who have been raped?

Does #bekind not go both ways? Should MW not be a bit less insensitive?

A woman who has been terrified by a man can be re-traumatised by seeing a person she perceives to be male through a frosted window, or out of the corner of her eye, or hearing a male voice next door. It is not possible to help her recover from the crime committed against her by a man if she is hyper-vigilant incase there is a man around.

Once again, the reasoning here is nothing to do with MW. It's got nothing to do with policing which TW "passes" and which does not. It's not mocking, it's not judging MW's appearance or saying that they need to do better to "pass". It's that many women see sex. It can't be hidden from us.

For traumatised women, and for the people who are supposed to be providing services to help them recover, MW's inability to disguise chromosomes is relevant, and can be counterproductive to a woman's recovery. I care more about that woman's recovery and her needs and her "no" than I do about MW's wish to be perceived as female.

A man can never be a woman. A woman is an adult human female. MW is not a woman. MW is a transwoman. But NOT a woman. How they identify is up to them, but we are not required to go along with this person's beliefs. My belief, rooted in science, is that MW is a man.

I also believe there is no God, but I guess that is not as contentious, for some reason.

"I saw someone pointing out the masculinity of the CEO -using a photo".

It's not a matter of pointing out masculinity. Anyone can be "masculine" using traditional gender norms. I am myself (short hair, jeans, no makeup etc etc).

Using a photo to show that the person is a man (a person of the male sex) is a different kettle of fish, and should be allowed because that fact is pertinent to their job and, it seems, pertinent to their attitude to women

"I agree that the appointment of the CEO is questionable. But they got the job."

That's a bit odd. I mean, are you suggesting that anyone who has a job should keep it regardless of their suitability and whether or not they were eligible for it, qualified for it, or lied to obtain it? They should keep it because they got it?

Lurkermum could you answer a couple of questions about your post please?

What does live as a woman mean?

Why do you think transwomen are less safe than women? Do you have any statistics to back this up?

How can we have a safe healthy discussion when we can't name basic facts?

#nothankyou
#cantshantwontsothere

#Be Kind

So 'therapy is political.' The cat is out of the bag and we are indebted to Mridhul Wadwa for this honest admission. Just as Charity came with strings attached in less enlightened times. Irish Famine victims would be given soup if they converted to Protestantism. Or unmarried mothers would be lectured on their sins by priests and nuns in some godawful 'home' or Magdalen laundry. And here we are again.

@ArabellaScott Thankyou for your comments - I can understand much you have said.

I saw someone pointing out the masculinity of the CEO -using a photo - which is unfair if they choose to live as a woman. Regardless of my beliefs or yours people are free to transition and if they choose too I think they should be able to live safely and with a level of acceptance . Much as I hope too- As a non trans person. A woman.from a non white background.
Maybe that’s why I am sensitive to what I see are comments beside the point. One bad egg does not make everyone the same. Not all trans folk are radical lunatics ( there are many ) who choose to live as they do and hope for a happy and fulfilled safe life … I think the anger I see and the awful comments make others unsafe who deserve to be safe . I think this is awful.

I in fact do have the same debate with trans people wherever possible - as I said I think everyone needs to learn tolerance and acceptance and be open to safe and healthy/ opinionated discussion - I don’t understand Twitter so I don’t use it - or the other forums you mentioned .
But yes. I agree there are dangerous and awful radical trans. I agree that the appointment of the CEO is questionable. But they got the job.

I agree that what they have said recently is questionable.

What I didn’t agree with is the things I’ve already stated.

Mw words And so you know, it is not discerning crime.

Some women deserve to be raped?

When 'bigotry' neans not accepting what men say does 'reframing' mean accepting what their rapist said?

Therapy should NEVER be political I do not understand that as a statement. Very strange.

Well, I can actually see that therapy is and can be a political act, in a sense. Everything is political; the personal is political, it's a choice to support someone and try to heal them instead of ignoring them or medicating them or whatever.

This applies to the process of therapy, the choice of therapy, and to an extent the principles any particular therapeutic method are founded on/accord with.

But Mridhul appears to be saying that the AIM of the therapy Mridhul offers is political, appears to be suggesting that the political is centred in their therapy rather than the person.

THAT, to my mind, is pernicious, underhand, callous and manipulative.

lurkermum, I know that the directness of women on this forum can sometimes be a shock. I felt it myself way back when. I would just note that there is a huge amount of anger on this subject, I think you can imagine very well why. I do my best to be compassionate and thoughtful and see both sides, I think most of the women here do the same.

In this case, my empathy lies with women in need of counselling that isn't gaslighting, women in need of a safe space that is guaranteed to be male free, as refuges used to be, as provision is clearly made out in the Equality Act, using exactly this instance as an example of where exceptions could be applied. And which Mridhul was appointed in direct contradiction to, despite the post of CEO being advertised clearly as for a female only.

and ridiculing pictures of this human.

This is another lie. Posts accurately naming Wadhwa’s sex have been deleted. One mentioned reading Wadhwa’s sex correctly in a video. Nobody ridiculed Wadhwa’s looks,

And this is where Mumsnet’s deletion policy removing polite posts that correctly identify sex gets us. We can be falsely accused of things that were never said and others who believe Munsnetters are awful will believe them.

This is still showing up on Twitter, 18.9k tweets. Still ongoing.

If this was a female CEO she'd be out on her arse, either through jumping ship or pushing out.

But no, like so many incidents of males pulling this bullshit before them, they bunker on down, and ignore women while it blows over

They identify as a woman And your definition of a woman is .... what? Mine is that women are adult human females and MW does not fulfil criteria.

People should be able to make choices about how they live their lives , who they choose to be - but everyone needs to also learn tolerance and understanding. Including that CEO- including women . Including everyone. Toxic doublespeak, with more than a little of be k... or else. No thank you.

MW is a liar with an agenda, and that agenda does not include any tolerance and understanding for women in distress. I'm not interested in being tolerant towards someone who disparages women.

Bump.

I don't care less what Wadhwa looks like. What I care about is the 'feminist' Nicola Sturgeon, the leader of my county, having under the guise of inclusion - passed a hate crime which does not include women as a group to be protected from hate, passed the same hate crime which means that private discussion in your own home can reported to the police as a hate crime (and remember GC views have been deemed perfectly legal), did not speak up for women politicians who received violent threats of corrective rape from members of her political party, has ignored public consultation regarding the GRA and done a second consultation because the Government didn't get the results they wanted, presides over a Government whose policy is privately TWAW but doesn't say it publically because they are aware that most people know that 'changing sex' is not possible and has contributed to the chilling effect, meaning women are silenced.

She is no feminist.

The appointment of Wadhwa, to a position they are not entitled to because of their sex, has caused enormous of amounts of anger in Scotland but it is ignored because this person's appointment is politically advantageous. There have been petitions and protests. All ignored. This photo is the visual sign of all this.

You want to see bullies? Check out www.terfisaslur.com. Check out the testimonies of women being told they are transphobic for not being attracted to dick. Check out the testimonies of the academics deplatformed for their (legal) views. And check out the avalanche of hate JKR got.

Be kind means 'shut up women'.

Women won't wheesht.

Seems to me that the person who should have been thoughtful here was MW - thoughtful about taking a role reserved for women and for calling traumatised women victims of rape 'bigots' if they didn't want a male counselling them and/or examining them.