I think I’m going mad….

I read that here on Mumsnet years ago, and it really struck a chord with me.

So, what are you doing now? You're knuckling under, keeping quiet, using headphones - making yourself as small as you can be. How's that working for you, huh? Getting any respect, anything positive from it? No. You're 'BeingKind' and in return they are 'BeingShitty'. It's time to stop doing what you've always done, isn't it?

I would suggest that next time they "nose at what I’m looking at over my shoulder" or anything else, you tell them to bugger off go away and stop being so rude to you. Call them bigots and homophobes and misogynists and say out loud that their inability to handle disagreement is childish and pathetic. Get angry! In short - go on the offensive, because being defensive is just emboldening them to treat you like shit.

And as for your husband! "Husband saying he doesn’t know why I’m so obsessed with trans matters and I should keep to myself" - tell him off! 'No, I will not keep my opinions to myself! I am your equal partner in this marriage and you don't get to tell me what to say and what to think. Back off!'

And as has already been suggested - stop doing nice things for them. Because after all, how can they bear to accept anything from a transphobe like yourself?

Push back. They don't accept that anyone can disagree with them, so you don't accept their rudeness. Fuck 'BeKind' - it's time to 'BeAssertive'.

I took a break for a few days. Am finding that various news stories etc are making me feel so angry, frustrated and helpless.

Been gobsmacked to come back and read this thread. I really hope the OP is ok.

I’m stunned at this poster’s contributions. I still can’t wrap my head around why certain factions are so keen to shout transphobia. When the majority of posts on here are not against trans people, but are for women’s rights, safety etc.

But these views go above and beyond. My gut instinct was to report the posts, but I haven’t because there are more knowledgable people on this thread who obviously haven’t. And am starting to see that letting opinions remain is a good thing.

One thing I’m learning is that there is a discernible difference in how posts come across. I’m almost desperate for a TRA to post a coherent, non-insulting and evidence-based message.

Ah! Thanks Floral. I was at the pub. Seems I missed it all.

(Off to look on that particular thread where lots of sunlight shone in and a live demonstration was enacted over the past day.).

Banned a reregged a couple of times, complaining that we weren't prepared to negotiate about homosexuality and that meant we had started a war. Prat. I dunno what's wrong with these people. Maybe they've got their rainbow lanyards done up too tight, cutting off the circulation.

Yes Floral. I did notice that they had some particularly horrific attitudes towards lesbians. So homophobic, misogynistic and racist. And simply ignorant to boot.

Did they get banned already then?

So.. did Bluebird come back and tell us exactly why they claim to speak for all trans people?

I may have missed the answer.

Here's thought experiment. I know a woman who has always had relationships with men. She is now in a relationship with someone who (I'm going to use the language of a certain side of history) identifies as female but was AMAB. Wears stereotypically male clothes, no change in behaviour, dress or attitude at all at the time of transition. No surgery.

Is the person I know straight, bi or lesbian? Because I have to say I find it illogical that this woman's sexuality changes based on the identification of her partner. Particularly as the young people I know have friends changing gender monthly. Do the people shagging them change sexuality dependent on that? What if their partner identifies differently but doesn't share that? Their sexuality changes without their knowledge?

I know young people just say they're pan and shag whomever they fancy (partly based on sex) but it seems illogical. Maybe it isn't so I'd love to have it explained.

LangCleg wrote Thu 21-Feb-19

"How did the scandal of TV entertainers grooming and exploiting children get so bad before anything was done?

How did the scandal of Catholic priests grooming and exploiting children get so bad before anything was done?

How did the scandal of on-street gangs grooming and exploiting children get so bad before anything was done?

Because if you create a sacred caste of any group and silence anyone asking questions about individuals on behalf of the sacred caste, abusers will see, infiltrate, and groom and exploit children. That''s how."

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3512177-Julia-Long-asking-Munro-Bergdorf-about-child-exploitation?pg=12

Just to clarify what I said about the church. it happened because the church had a central role in education and care in Ireland. This was because abusers who wish to exploit others place themselves in positions where that is possible and/or where they can evade safeguarding that is applied to others. Also, as the Irish state (gov't etc.) didn't take their responsibility seriously, it went on without oversight.

It is not simply that it was the church. The state failed to protect and safeguard Irish citizens. Or take action against abuses. Abusers could act with impunity.

What a way to make kids not just be embarrassed by you but also despise you.

Well, I am so, so surprised with such a jibe! Seems 'be kind' is a big old pretence. You'd have to be some nasty piece of work to come out with that to a mother in relation to her two children.

Op. The children I would be able to understand. They are impressionable and there are many people online, and even getting into schools, who are perpetuating lots of anti science stuff. In all areas of life.

The OH is the one which would trouble me most. At first, mine didn't know what I was going on about. Told him about the male sex offenders being put in women's prisons in Ireland. Told him how this wasn't one offs, but the law being changed and you can fill in an A4 form in Ireland and you change from a man to a woman in law; with all the evasion of safeguarding pertinent to males that entails. It won't be rescinded even if a person is a rapist or sex offender. He couldn't believe that males of any persuasion, never mind rapists and sexual abusers, would be locked up with women. How women would be deliberately made vulnerable like that. However, we are aware that the Irish state and previous Irish governments has form on allowing the brutalisation of women and children. Or not acting to stop it. The Irish state effectively allowed it to take place as they didn't police, properly inspect or safeguard the children which were looked after by religious orders. The police, agents of the state, even returned escaped adult women to 'house arrest' in Magdalen laundries. Women who had committed no crimes. We know that people who did not have good intentions insinuated themselves into organisations and jobs for nefarious reasons. This happened in Ireland because the church had a central role in education and care. So we don't think that Roderic O'Gorman and his mates are new in their attitude to women and girls.

Sports and the olympics was the final straw for my OH on his realisation about what is happening. He knows that even in same sex events like boxing that there are different categories for a reason.

We are completely of the 'wear what you want and don't be limited by stereotypes' variety. He knows however that biological sex is immutable. He is a scientist and doesn't fall for young earth creationism, vaccination being a bad thing, or the earth being flat either. Fairly immune to fads and ideologies.

I get him to read some stuff now and then. He now has much less of a regard for David Walsh who thinks it is all fine and dandy for males to be able to compete against women (with male levels of testosterone which would be unnatural for women), and as long as the women can't dope everything is fine according to Walsh. Would yours actually read about what is happening and how women's rights are being diminished? Mine really got the Irish Women's Lobby podcast, chaired by Christine Gaffney, with Iseult White and other speakers.

Lesbian has a specific meaning. You don't get to just change that to mean something else. Lesbian sexuality is protected in law.

Get another word.

Because you do not get to decide that a trans woman is "not a lesbian".

We don’t get to decide? What an odd idea. Of course we don’t.

It’s simply a fact that men are not lesbians.

It may annoy you that you have no power to change facts, and that the facts are against you, but there it is.

BluebirdsSong

There will be lurkers on here who won't have made their mind up. We've managed to get quite a few to come off the fence. Maybe you can do the same if your arguments and evidence are strong enough.

BluebirdsSong

"I could, but we both know you happen go agree with her transphobic rhetoric, so what's the point?"

Just one, itsy, bitsy example. Go on, you know you want to

God I love you vipers. Hope OP is ok.

Trans lesbians are not "heterosexual". Trans women's attraction to women includes other trans women. That's not "heterosexual" in any way.

I agree with you on the above point.

A woman in a relationship with a woman is a homosexual relationship, as they are both of the same sex, female.

A transwoman in a relationship with a transwoman is a homosexual relationship, as they are both of the same sex, male.

A woman in a relationship with a transwoman is in a heterosexual relationship as they are of different sexes, female and male.

See how this works?

Teens are very vulnerable to peer pressure and desperate to rebel against their parents (especially mothers). Social media constantly chants the mantras and demands that kids don't educate themselves on the rights conflicts and that is supported by the bias in the once impartial/progressive media like the BBC and the Guardian and the pushing of gender ideology in schools. My teen fell for the JKR is a transphobe narrative but did finally read her essay after we talked. We also had a falling out over LGB Alliance but we talked through the reasons they have been vilified by trans activists. She is starting to read into the issues now and isn't so quick to just accept what teens are being fed. But it is an uphill struggle.

Or change the password to ILoveJKRowling or something

Love this 😁

Yeah, but they're in your corner on me headed for condemnation for being a homosexual.

Oopsie.

They're now saying homosexuals should be shunned.

I mean, I haven't had this much homophobic battering since I was debating calvinist evangelicals.