Deleted/censorship on mumsnet now!

It's so funny that we were sectioned off to the naughty corner because of 'emails' from those who were so offended by all the women championing female rights, that they must have the ability to block an entire board as it was so upsetting, triggering, problematic, mean etc etc etc and yet so many seem to still manage to find themselves here....

We're not allowed to post anything that challenges the narrative by pointing out facts.

[quote NecessaryScene]how does one do that? I know what an url is, but which one? And then go onto a website called achive.org and put it in there, is that it?

The URL for the deleted thread, which you should have from your history if you were reading it. The one that now shows the deletion message. Copy that URL in to the Wayback Machine there on archive.org, and it should come straight up. (You'll need to click on the date link).

I'm being coy because I doubt it's okay to link directly to a copy of a deleted thread.

This more general link should show all things archived from Mumsnet today. But it's just sitting there spinning for me at the moment.

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20210806*/www.mumsnet.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20210806/www.mumsnet.com/*[/quote]
Sorry. I don’t understand. What do I put in the search box and how? Not terribly literate… Thanks.

She truly was a loss.

I had heard of some of the disgusting responses when she died, but I had never seen her until today. What a loss.

Where can I watch the rest?

Magdalen Berns. There's plenty of her work on YouTube. She has sadly died (in case you didn't know), but never forgotten.

Oh well, I saw it and it peaked at least one person.

I don't care anymore if some people don't like me, or think I'm being mean, or think I'm overreacting. This is too important to ignore.

Agree. TRAs and their supporters can call me all the names they like, can accuse me of whatever - right-wing, transphobic, in the pay of the Christian Right - their accusations are baseless and I couldn't, and never did, give a flying fuck.

I love her!

Where can I watch the rest?

#NoThankYou

As for the consider talking to trans people directly - been there, done that got the T-Shirt.

Will I consider or do it again? No thankyou.

The lovely Magdalen ♥️ Nails it as ever.

So now I actively challenge to make sure women's legal rights are upheld and don't include people that are not women. Every single time. I don't need to take on board the opinions of males who identify as females. Not when it comes to sex based rights. No chance. Why would I.

And that is as it should be.

Trans activists do not take on board the opinions of women, and I wouldn't expect them to either.

Campaigns centred around groups should campaign specifically for their groups.

It's clear though that women's rights are handled differently in the current climate - it is deemed somehow improper for women to clearly stand up for themselves, rather than worrying about everyone else.

(On this subject, one of my favourite Magdalen Berns videos - I still find it hard to believe this thing isn't a parody).

What I would expect is those in positions of responsibility, such as politicians, to listen to campaigners on all sides, and balance competing demands.

And YY especially the last paragraph.

This is not going to go away on its own. There are too many entitled men invested in bringing us down. And by the time the general public wakes up the reality of this, it will be too late as far as legislation goes. Self ID is already law in Ireland, where I live. And nobody is even talking about it. So fucking depressing.

They have targeted our laws and our spaces. They mean business. They are not just going to go away quietly, now they have tasted a bit of the glory.

That's why joining organisations like Sex Matters is so important, as they can lobby for pushback. There are so many of us out there, but we need to band together to shout louder.
Talk to MPs and elected representatives, talk to people we know. Keep talking about this. Keep donating to crowdfunders, keep sending emails, I think doing something is what is stopping me from going mad.

I don't care anymore if some people don't like me, or think I'm being mean, or think I'm overreacting. This is too important to ignore.

Anyway, the way I see it is like this:

I spent years wasting time trying to reason with trans people (generally males identifying as women) mainly on twitter. And here. Trying to be kind. And for my efforts I was generally repaid with rudeness and threats. For speaking up for women's rights.

Then one day I though, hmm, I've had enough of this. I don't need to try and appeal to the better nature of many of these people. (NATWALT). After all, really, women's rights and safeguards have nothing to do with males identifying as females. Nothing. At. All.

So now I actively challenge to make sure women's legal rights are upheld and don't include people that are not women. Every single time. I don't need to take on board the opinions of males who identify as females. Not when it comes to sex based rights. No chance. Why would I.

So when people say that we should consider talking to trans people directly, my answer is this: I've considered it. And the answer is no.

That's pretty much it. Things are much more focussed and clearer now.
☺️

The bottom line is IF we had a society and a structure that took the safety and well being of women and children extremely seriously we would not be in this position in the first place, of having to argue to have a safe space whilst we are very ill or injured in hospital or unable to defend ourselves in a tiny cell. This should not even be up for discussion, at all! Much less being bartered and decided by a bunch of men who have absolutely no idea of our predicament in Westminster. It is an astonishing situation we find ourselves in.

Every woman regardless should be entitled to feel and be physically safe from harm in all settings, and the very fact we are having to scream and shout just to secure a basic human need is a terrible, terrible indictment of our times.

So many things have to change, and it really needs to start now. We have to change this from the top down. We can talk about it as much as we like on forums, but we need to start applying pressure in huge numbers now or I am afraid it will continue to be swept under the carpet as if our safety is meaningless.

Women are the experts in what women need

Exactly. Seems bizarre that there's an expectation that we should need to ask. Especially as there's lots of academic information at our fingertips.
Just a cursory glance over twitter gives us a flavour of where many of the individuals are at if we really wanted to know their thoughts. Those few with something more sensible to say generally step forward and respectfully say it. The rest, threats of violence, name calling, doxing, well, I don't really care about what those individuals have to say anyway.

Regardless, when it comes to women's needs and rights, we don't need to consult trans people over that. Do we.

This!

For those who like to call posters on here names. For those who like to assert that we have no knowledge, no experience... we are talking about preserving women's rights. Exactly WHAT knowledge and experience do you reckon we DON'T have?

I will wait patiently for an answer.

Nope.

Women are the experts in what women need.

If people are truly interested in this topic then they should consider talking to trans people directly

Been there. Done that. Some transwomen are willing to engage. Many are not. Many like to threaten and dox instead.
Regardless, when it comes to women's needs and rights, we don't need to consult trans people over that. Do we.

@Kotatsu

Very true.

If I believed, I would be non-binary, agender. Although a few of the newer genders might fit better.

If people are truly interested in this topic then they should consider talking to trans people directly rather than shouting into an echo chamber where the majority of people are not trans, and trans views were not represented

I've read the definition - I think you'll find that actually, a large majority of us do fall under the trans umbrella (myself included) - we just think that it's bunkem.

It's not about the evidence, it's about the narrative, for example: MN is a nest of transphobia. It is easier to freely form a narrative when the underlying evidence is no longer available.

Yes, some posters do like to push that particular narrative. And yet... those very same posters rarely post any evidence for any of their assertions. They simply try to rely on their emotive posts which are not the posts that readers remember. The posts that readers remember are those that make them think, reconsider their views and have evidence to support them. From any point of view.

But, those other style of posters will still continue and that is great. Sometimes another poster will chip in with a post they think is a great 'gotcha' or a one line support post.

It becomes a live demonstration of the superficiality of activist style arguments and the tactics that rely on shaming to silence those accused of wrong think. If they backed up their posts with information that had a solid foundation and could be discussed, it would be wonderful.

If people are truly interested in this topic then they should consider talking to trans people directly rather than shouting into an echo chamber where the majority of people are not trans, and trans views were not represented

I have no desire to speak with people who call me a TERF or a bigot or tell me they want me to die in a fire. And, yes, these things have happened to me.

I still hold out hope that a visitor will be able to answer one day.

There are some transwomen on mumsnet who frequently add important points to conversations. Long term posters who understand the fears and concerns of women. I find those posts make me think.