Is it only white middle class women who are GC?

You really have to question the values of someone who measures humanity and worth by the colour of your skin, your income, your biology and the accident of your birth. Rights only for the right colour/income/class/politics.

*so say the soi-disant campaigners for a fairer world.

Everyone these days is entitled to safe spaces, except... women. Especially white, middle-class women, they aren't entitled to human rights sexually intimidating behaviour, apparently.

So say the soi-disa

And thank you purgatory for posting your extracts for others to follow along.

they will not be required to share cells with trans women

I look forward to seeing the proof of this claim.

But even so, we have had posters who have come onto MN to tell us their experience of being imprisoned with transitioned males. One in particular stands out. They relayed their experience of the male who targeted them by showering in full view with their erect penis being exhibited. They may or may not have been one of the witnesses in the MoJ case.

What exactly is in it for females to have males included in their prison estate? Specific benefits please.

Not RTFT but I am brown and GC.

Also not RTFT, white, MC and GC here. Should I be ashamed? It seems to be a way of saying "shut up women".

Post 4

extract

ACalifornia lawallowing transgender inmates to pick the prison gender of their choice has come under fire from a women’s rights group citing abuse of females by men.

Ina letterto Gov. Gavin Newsom, theWomen’s Liberation Frontaccused the state of violating the constitutional rights of incarcerated women by allowing men into their living quarters to “prey on women.” Since the law took effect on Jan. 1, WLF has received numerous complaints of assaulted, abused, and traumatized women at the hands of male inmates transferred into their prisons, WoLF Legal Director Lauren Adams said.

“We are working with a woman who was punched in the face so hard by a new transfer that she couldn’t chew for three days. He was taken away and released back in a different yard with no restrictions,” Adams said. “He was her cellmate. She had to sleep with him.”

Other women have been sexually abused in the past and must now contend with nude men sharing communal showers, Adams said.

“One woman went in there with two naked men showering who still had penises,” Adams added. “It was incredibly traumatic and scary, to know for, [possibly], the rest of their lives they are going to be subjected to this.”

The state currently has 273 transfer requests; 266 are from people housed at male institutions requesting to be transferred to a female institution, and seven are from people at female institutions requesting to be transferred to a male institution, according to the Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation. California has 1,286 inmates identified as transgender or nonbinary.

Currently, 24 male prisoners have been transferred to female institutions. WoLF theorizes that many men transferring into women’s prisons are not transgender but are just trying to escape their current living situation.

“A lot of these men checking the box and trying to get transfers are probably trying to save their lives. I wouldn’t want to be in the men’s prison,” Adams said. “You are giving them a way to get out of that, but now it’s the women who are in danger.”

Most women in state prison have been abused at some point in their lives, and many have endured sexual assaults. Having to sleep in a cell with a man or shower with them is traumatic, Adams said.

State law requires a committee to vet the transfers, but a large number of men who got through have violent pasts. For example, one male transfer was convicted of assaulting two boys aged 6 and 8. Another had multiple counts of forcible rape, and he still had his penis, Adams said.

A CDCR spokesperson told the Washington Examiner the transfer process includes “a thorough review of the incarcerated person’s history prior to and during incarceration, their crime, arrest and criminal history, trial and sentencing documentation, medical and mental health needs ...”

WoLF is asking the governor to halt all new transfers and remove the inmates who have already transferred until a safety assessment can be made.

CDCR did not respond to a request for comment as of press time.

Continues
news.yahoo.com/newsom-needs-halt-transgender-mixing-201200699.html

The TW, who were too high risk to be permitted into the female estate, were to have had that unit to have enabled them to be in the estate in a safer way for the female prisoners.

The TW however fought it legally on the grounds of discrimination, and won, and went into the female estate risks and all.

Whopping waste of money, resources, attempts to balance needs, and as usual females ended up being nothing more than a resource for a group of males whose voices and political clout wholly outweighs females. Their wishes matter more than the safety of any female in that estate.

Thank you. That's a really good reminder that even when it seems pointless trying to argue that other women are here listening even when this particular political lobby aren't.

Post 3

They may not like trans women in the women's system, or they may well not care, but I'm willing to bet if you actually asked women in prison what could be done to improve their lives then getting rid of the trans women would be pretty low down the list compared to better food, more recreation and education, shorter and more home-based sentences etc

Your wording betrays you there. As can be seen, you haven't asked and you are speculating that they do not care.

I, on the other hand, have asked. I happened to already know women who have previously been incarcerated before I started posting on here, and it is in part the trans activists' casual and blasé attitude to incarcerated women's dignity and safety that has led me here.

Talking of "recreation and education" for incarcerated women, did you notice the special building for transwomen prisoners that was set up few years back in the grounds of a women's prison? At HMP Downview. That land was taken from the facilities for women there. Certainly not available for recreation after that, was it. I've seen claims that there were originally plan to place educational facilities there for the women.

But those plans were sacrificed to serve a small group of male prisoners instead.

I shouldn't bother trying Janis I could list all my various characteristics too as evidence, but if we were listened to, you'd find you were the 'wrong kind of brown'.

This isn't a two way conversation.

Not RTFT but I am brown and GC.

Post 2:

Firstly they will not be required to share cells with trans women

Is this a personal guarantee? What power do you have to enforce this promise?

extract

United States — Olympia, Washington.

A level 1 sex offender convicted of the rape of a 12-year-old girl was transferred to a women’s prison, where he groomed and raped a woman who is developmentally disabled and a survivor of sexual abuse, a commercial radio station and editorial publication are reporting. Hobbie Bingham was convicted in Louisiana in 2003 for the offense of Carnal Knowledge Of A Juvenile. He was imprisoned for just two years, with a judge handing him a six-year sentence with four years suspended. Mr Bingham was also required to register as a low-level sex offender.

While imprisoned again for further offenses, Mr Bingham, who had by then begun identifying as a woman named Princess Zoee Andromeda Love, became one of three male inmates in the state of Washington whose request for transfer to women’s prison was granted after January 1, 2021, responsive documents obtained by Women’s Liberation Front (WoLF) from the Washington State Department of Corrections (WADOC) revealed in May.

According to the “Dori Monson Show” on KIRO Radio, an anonymous employee found Mr Andromeda Love having “sex” with a female inmate. The National Review yesterday revealed that the discovery of the two, who had been cellmates for a week, “unclothed” and in bed together was made by a female officer. The National Review obtained an incident summary, which disclosed that Mr Andromeda Love had convinced the woman, who had the “disposition of a young child,” that the pair were “soulmates.” Scott Fleming, who worked as a guard at the prison at the time and learned of the incident from the officer who discovered the cellmates in bed, said he observed it as a “predator/victim interaction post-assault,” rather than “two inmates in love, after having consensual intercourse.”

Continue reading Male Rapist of 12-Year-Old Girl Groomed Vulnerable Woman While in Women’s Prison | Women Are Human. Read more at: www.womenarehuman.com/male-rapist-of-12-year-old-girl-groomed-vulnerable-woman-while-in-womens-prison/

The 'rich white overprivileged bored mummies with no grip on reality' thing is being given a real try as the new way to avoid having to listen to women, isn't it?

Yeah, no.

Try something else. You missed out the accusations about right wing, anti abortion, in bed with the Russians/Trump/the Klingons/Mrs Cake, American Christian extremism and whether women have souls, chop chop.

Thank you purgatory for posting that.

And as we have seen from many posters on MN FWR many people are either working to directly help women in need AND activating to ensure all females are getting the rights they need / maintaining those rights already established.

And there are many well known feminists who are also working for both. 600 people attended a seminar held to discuss prison reform recently. Rhona Hotchkiss and Julie Bindel are just two.

(By the way. It was protested by trans activists who mocked women, mocked lesbians and even abused the other people attending a different conference.)

The prejudice some posters have against women fighting to ensure that females can maintain their rights, those that are there to address the needs they have due to sexist discrimination because of their sexed body, where those rights conflict with other groups is apparent in their derisive posts.

The snideness is never far from their posts. And they continue to make negative generalisations in an attempt to silence and shame.

Post 1: It is this prioritising of this issue over and above everything else which appears to negate the realities of working class lives and political objectives.

Excuse me. I may be about to die of irony poisoning.

The group A Woman's Place had a meeting about welfare for women in prison which discussed multiple issues.

A group of trans demands protestors gathered outside to hurl misogynistic and racist abuse and participants, and attendees. Those participants included women who had formerly been imprisoned. So why is the inclusion of some males in women's prisons of such high priority that it's makes it okay to shout abuse at women who happen to also campaign for single-sex spaces too?

Content Warning: direct quotes from the activists' misogynistic and racist attacks.

After attendees, staff and volunteers were subject to an abusive protest at our recent meeting, A Woman’s Place is NOT in prison, we have written the following letter to the Socialist Workers Party (SWP) calling on them to repudiate racism, misogyny and other abuse at any protests they are associated with.

As this is a matter of great importance for feminists, socialists, people of colour and trade unionists we feel it is essential that any exchange of views is in the public domain.

This blog contains details of misogynistic, racist and other abuse.

Dear SWP,

Your paper’s coverage of the protests against Professor Kathleen Stock at the University of Sussex made it clear that the SWP believes it is legitimate for women who recognise that sex is a material reality to be harassed and intimidated at their workplace. The protests have now resulted in Professor Stock being obliged to leavethe university. While the piece does say that women like us should not be driven out of our jobs, it gave a signal to your members that they have your organisation’s support if they take part in such protests, whatever the professional or personal impact on the targeted woman.

D, who identifies as an SWP member on Twitter, organised just such a protest at our public meeting AWoman’s Place Is (Not) In Prison on Wednesday October 27th at the QE2 Centre in London.

D’s public Twitter feed encourages people to join the SWP. D has retweeted statements suggesting that protesting at events like ours is a form of “anti-fascist solidarity”. The same individual also tweeted the time and location of our meeting encouraging people to protest at it and described Joanna Cherry MP and women who share her opinions as “absolute Nazis”.

Almost 600 women had bought tickets to hear an all-woman panel discuss how prison punishes women for being poor, violently abused and vulnerable. It was a meeting which would have been of interest to any socialist or feminist as it was discussing the cruelties of the prison system and alternatives to it for vulnerable working-class women. [bold mine]

There were only about six protestors and videos of them arecirculating widelyonline.

Our event coincided with a conference for Black people in business as part of Black History Month.

People attending our event and the Black business meeting, venue staff and our stewards were subjected to the most extreme outpouring of racist and misogynistic abuse. The apparent organiser and leader of the protest, D, and the SWP by association, bear responsibility for the protestors’ language and behaviour.

These include comments such as:

“Shut the fck up, you cnt”shouted into the face of our chief steward.

“Call Weightwatchers, your body’s not doing it.”

“Your hair is minging, buy a weave.”

“Your breath smells like you’ve been eating are, have you been eating her ase?”

“Are you a lesbian? No man would want that.”

“Your breasts are on the floor, buy a bra and some hair dye too.”

“You fucking bald b*tch.”

“You’re a stuck-up b*tch.”

“I have a better body than you. Like, you have no bum. How do you sit down? What kind of man would want you? A blind man?”

“We don’t want pensioners. We don’t want dinosaurs like all you lot. You are not going to be around in 40 years. Well, 40’s a push.”

“You call yourself a woman? DIE! DIE! DIE!”

To people arriving for the Black Business event (who did not interact with the protestors):

“You went through slavery, you went through discrimination, rape, sexual harassment, the slave masters raped and sexually abused you and now you are abusing me, as a trans woman?”

“You were persecuted. You were nothing under slavery.”

“You look me in the eye. Your ancestors went through slavery and you are here. Hang your head in shame. Slave Master! Yes! Slave Master!”

“You call yourself Black people?”

“Why are you here? Are you supporting these Nazis? Are you supporting neo-Nazis?”

We are asking that the SWP openly stands up to racism and misogyny organised and facilitated by one of its members. As a self-described socialist taking part in the protest and someone who has spoken on behalf of Stand Up To Racism, D had a duty either to tell his collaborators to stop the racism, misogyny and offensive behaviour against women at the venue or to walk away from it. D did neither but instead contributed to it.

It will be apparent to you from watching the videos that our activists refused to engage with the abuse. We are committed to respectful debate on questions of sex and gender with people who disagree with us.

The intimidation to which we were subjected by people who are practising what you preach will not prevent us from organising other major events in the coming months.

We are part of a resurgent women’s liberation movementto which your group is hostile. We accept that, but we would like an assurance that if your members take your paper’s advice and protest against us that they will not permit abusive, racist, misogynistic behaviour at mobilisations for which you are politically responsible.

Some of our activists work alongside SWP members in unions and campaigns. This is an impossible relationship to maintain if people in the SWP are saying in public that we are equivalent to fascists. If this is now the approved position of the SWP it needs to be stated explicitly. If it is not, that also needs to be stated explicitly, if only for the benefit of your members who seem unclear on the question.

The best way for your organisation to do that is to publish a public statement unequivocally repudiating racism, ageism and misogyny which will remind your supporters that they are unacceptable in every circumstance.

WPUK

womansplaceuk.org/2021/10/30/open-letter-swp-abusive-protest/

The majority of women in prison are from lower socio-economic backgrounds, many of them are victims of horrendous abuse and they do not want to share their cells, showers or open spaces with rapists and paedophiles who identify as women, they do not want to be used as validation tools for said rapists and paedophiles womanly feelings.

Firstly they will not be required to share cells with trans women. But I think this probably highlights the differing interests. Most women in prison would rather not be there, and would rather have not had the lives that led them there. It is those primarily economic matters which tend to be the main focus.. They may not like trans women in the women's system, or they may well not care, but I'm willing to bet if you actually asked women in prison what could be done to improve their lives then getting rid of the trans women would be pretty low down the list compared to better food, more recreation and education, shorter and more home-based sentences etc.

It is this prioritising of this issue over and above everything else which appears to negate the realities of working class lives and political objectives. If you're worried about being evicted, or your kids are hungry then which toilet trans women use is unlikely to be a political priority and I'm sure most in that position would love to see the same energy that's poured into the gender critical movement be directed towards the things that are actually blighting working class women's lives on a daily basis.

I really don't understand this notion the people who know the difference between male and female and all that entails are somehow out of touch with reality and not worthy of consideration.

Do you really think that working class or people who are not white cannot see the implications of Self ID?

Or are you going to switch to a different argument now?

But I think what this thread really highlights is that regardless of their views on trans women this is not really a matter of huge concern to the working class.

You know nothing of the concerns of the working class as this take from you so amply demonstrates. The working class do not want their daughters sharing toilets and changing rooms at school with boys who declare themselves girls. This is also the case with immigrant and religious communities some who are already at the very edges of society.

It absolutely does affect their lives and the decimation of services they may have to access being single sex is of paramount importance to them.

The majority of women in prison are from lower socio-economic backgrounds, many of them are victims of horrendous abuse and they do not want to share their cells, showers or open spaces with rapists and paedophiles who identify as women, they do not want to be used as validation tools for said rapists and paedophiles womanly feelings.

Look at the supporters of gender ideology they are most definitely not marginalised or working class, invariably they are white and extremely privileged, more often that not male and often not trans, they will never have to face what women on the very margins of society face so they don't give a stuff as to how this ideology impacts on those women, as long as them and theirs are okay and they can wave their ally colours and abuse anyone who speaks out against the ideology from the comfort and safety of their ivory tower they are as happy as pigs in shit.

Although I would rather we had a functioning social housing system which meant people didn't have to make such choices.

No

Oh, I think you understand the relevance very well.