Menopause Cafe confusion

Transmen should be welcomed in my opinion, they may not all want their own group, while I’d happily arrange their own group (if possible) I’d hate them to feel unwelcome in a group of women.

As would we all. However, including members of the opposite sex is another matter.

Thank you 🙏🏼

I don’t think Viktorias tone is very confrontational, a few misunderstandings perhaps. It’s not her fault the menopause cafe is an established format with men welcome, and she’s taken on board the clarifications. Transmen should be welcomed in my opinion, they may not all want their own group, while I’d happily arrange their own group (if possible) I’d hate them to feel unwelcome in a group of women.

Yes 👍🏻

I have apologised if my interpretation was wrong. Totally up for holding my hands up if I have misunderstood.

Really only want to explain why the Charity of the Menopause Cafe (not me) decided they want conversations open for all. Though I have been now told that women only Menopause cafes can happen 😊 according to the Menopause Cafe website.

Been good to chat to you all. 😊💛

From the website:
* Menopause Cafes are not support groups
* Menopause Cafes are not an opportunity to give people information about the menopause, regardless of how useful or important this information is.
*Menopause Cafes are not a method for community engagement, research or consultation.

So it's really just people sitting around chatting while drinking tea?

@VictoriaK71 I will never be comfortable with men (however they identify) being involved in a group where I am expected to discuss not only the extremely personal symptoms and consequences of my menopause and I certainly won't get involved with any group that is run by someone who comes across as you do. This is not a personal insult however you come across as very confrontational (possibly because you feel attacked) rather than conciliatory, you are basically implying that we are either bigots or transphobic and are minimizing our (women) feelings whilst lecturing us on why we should be happy to not have a female only group and be happy to be a teaching example for men.
I suggest that you have a think about the tone YOU are using and why you think that it is appropriate then you should apologise for the disrespect that you have shown the women on this thread

Sorry totally didn’t read this properly. Trying to reply to too many comment 🤦🏻‍♀️. Thanks so much that is really good to know. 😊

Maybe it was the punctuation?

Punctuation is a bitch to be fair

(Hopefully there is not a mumsnet poster called punctuation 😳)

Also: which comments about transmen bother you, Victoria? Hasn't everyone said they are happy for all females to be there? Not sure why that makes you sad?

Yes I was perplexed by that comment too.

Only biological females, rather!

Sorry will get there in the end it is www.menopausecafe.net/ thanks for your patience 😊🙏🏼

Oooh that is really interesting thank you for bringing that to my attention. That hadn’t been made clear but really good to know. 👍🏻😊 Here is the weblink for others to look at too. My previous web links were wrong but this is correct www.menopausecafe.net/

It's not even just about the creeps and voyeurs, or the transwomen misusing menopause support groups for personal validation. Even one entirely well intentioned man being admitted to a group intended for women can result in the purpose of the group being derailed, both because due to our social conditioning some women will automatically focus on and centre the man and because even entirely well intentioned men who only want to support their partners often don't see when they're hijacking the narrative or mansplaining. I'm all for men learning about the menopause, but a mutual support group for women should not be required to take on that role as well.

I can understand why transmen might want a group of their own.

Tone wasn't negative either. Comments and tone were positively inclusive of all biological females (irrespective of whether they proclaim a gender identity, or how that expresses itself). Makes sense really as a support group. All biological females, who live long enough, will go through this as it is specific to our bodies.

Maybe it was the punctuation?

@VictoriaK71 did you actually read my comment? You are wrong when you say it is against the rules to have a woman only session. It's on the website that you can, I quoted.

Sorry predictive text it is www.menopausecafe.com

I totally hold my hands up if I misinterpreted what the comment intended.
My main point is to explain why the www.menopausecafes.com think everyone should be allowed to attend. The Menopause Cafe South London do not make these rules we just have to adhere to them if we want to use the title Menopause Cafe.
Really I don’t want to fight with anyone as the Menopause Cafe is to support. Would love you all to come along and see what it is actually like which is a warm, supportive, nurturing space where we all feel safe and comfortable. I hope you all have a great day and it has been good to discuss a very important subject. 😊

Re age I’m nearing 40 and I’d certainly go to one at work and would have since starting work to understand more about this thing I would go through and how it might affect me.

Yes if a women only group was requested this could be set up like the trans only group or a men only group but I believe it would need to be called something different to a Menopause Cafe. Maybe a Menopause Discussion Group and wouldn’t be advertised on the Menopause Cafe website.

It says on the website that the groups could be female only.

In general Menopause Cafes are open to, and respectful of, people of all ages and genders (or none). However, it is fine to have Menopause Cafes for specific groups e.g. women only. Wherever possible these should be facilitated by people who are from that group.

I am going to discuss this situation of some women feeling uncomfortable with men being allowed to join

That would be good

I’m beginning to loathe the word tone

Tone is in the eye of the beholder….everyone on this thread seemed really careful about how they phrased their posts

Its not fair that you can write a really supportive post inclusive of trans people and then someone rocks up and says oh the words are ok…its the tone

Sorry wrong address www.menopausecafe.com bloody predictive text changed it in the post 🥴

As I said these are not rules set by me or the other women running our specific group but those set by www.menopausecafesouthlondon.com

This.

I am a menopausal woman and I also wouldn't attend this kind of event.