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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What are all the liberal celebs so quiet now at the spa?

288 replies

ClarrieGrundy · 05/07/2021 09:29

So we all knew that a man would get his cock out in front of women and little girls in a changing room at some point. And we would be told that the toddlers should just get over their bigotry.

Anyway, I was wondering why we haven't heard from all the slebs who have be parroting the TWAW line. Has anyone heard? Has anyone come out and and defended this brave penis? (Which I bet was a little bit hard as it sat exposing itself to a changing room full of women and little girls.)

Emma Watson? Sarah Silverman? Daniel Radcliffe? Why so quiet?

I listen to a few podcasts from comedians based in LA and I am always saddened to hear the casual way that LA millennials have decided that JKR is now toxic. Haven't heard anything about this yet from all of them.

Or am I being unfair?

OP posts:
WinterTrees · 05/07/2021 13:18

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Helleofabore · 05/07/2021 13:18

The 'receipts' cannot be posted here. We have learned the hard way that we cannot post images or tweets or even mention the name of people who are involved.

But, they are easy to find on twitter.

FijiCavanaugh · 05/07/2021 13:16

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HecatesCatsInFancyHats · 05/07/2021 13:15

Because that's rather... unhinged.

'Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation involving distorting the truth in order to confuse or instill doubt in another person to the point they question (their sanity or) reality.'

334bu · 05/07/2021 13:14

334bu

So yeahbutnaw you don't believe this actually happened and if it did, woman complaining is not nice anyway. Obviously you didn't watch the video and didn't see the other women milling about, obviously having vacated the women's section, nor the other women complaining and asking for their money back.
Just for information , what kind of woman is allowed to complain that a male person is naked in a section of a spa dedicated to female clients and their children? Or then again, maybe you see nothing wrong with a random male stranger getting naked in front of women and children?

Is your argument that, "even if it didn't happen, we have a right to make noise about it"?

Because that's rather... unhinged.

😂😂😂

So how about answering my questions?
Who is allowed to complain ? What credentials do they have to have?
Do you agree with allowing random naked males into areas where females are naked ?

yeahbutnaw · 05/07/2021 13:13

@Datun

Still yeahbutnaw, i'm glad to see that there is a semblance of dismay from you, in that you are trying to de-fang what this person has done. Albeit by attempting to undermine the woman calling them out.

Presumably, you do actually see the problem involved in pretending that this person is a female, with a female penis.

That's a no to the receipts then?
ClarrieGrundy · 05/07/2021 13:13

It's a good point about those who support the MeToo movement who are also supporters of the old 'get your cock and balls out before 4 year old girls' routine.

This point struck me as I'm a fan of the My Favorite Murder podcast; very successful pod with 2 women talking about true crime. I really rate them; they are open about mental health issues and promote the idea of women trusting their gut if they are in a situation where they feel something is 'off'.

In fact, one of their catch phrases is 'Fuck politeness' in the context of; if a man is making you feel uncomfortable, don't spare his feelings to get out of the situation.

They covered the murder of a transwoman, and I thought they did it sensitively, with respect. This is a positive thing.

But then they followed it up with a quote from the (widely discredited) Chase Strangio, and some platitudes about trans people, and the announcement that they were giving a large donation to a trans supporting charity.

Now, I do not doubt for one second that they did this in good faith. I do not doubt that they thought that they would be helping marginalized individuals in need (and that's a good thing!).

But I would bet my last Wispa bar that they have not considered the fates of the women inmates of prisons who will now be houses with fully intact men. I bet being locked in prison with a sex offender with an erection would feel 'off' to a lot of women.
Or that little girls would be in the wrong becuase they did not want to see a stranger's scrotum before they turned 6.

But you can't have it both ways. You can't support the ACLU and its claims that there is no such thing as biological sex and also recognise that the vast majority of sexual assault is perpetrated by men against women. And yes, women know.

These are two women who have made a strong case for victims rights; they are on the side of the victim. But a bit of rainbow PR, lack of critical thought, and fear of being branded transphobic has brought them into line.

OP posts:
Helleofabore · 05/07/2021 13:13

@yeahbutnaw

From the viral video woman's Instagram.

Definitely not a false flag op though, right?

Shall we post some images and quotes from activists that support the inclusion of males being able to have their penises out within a metre of a 9 year old girl and get into the tub with a 6 year old girl?

Are you persisting with the 'look at who you are all aligning with' tactic?

Are you denying the graphic video evidence of a group of people who identify as females yet do things in female toilets that I can reasonably state not one 'female' does (because they don't have the anatomy to do it)?

Because supporting access to female single sex spaces means you must be fully in support of that group to be there too.

Are you denying that the side who supports males being able to be naked with penises on display has any ideas that you, personally, don't support? And we cannot even mention them here in this thread as we will be deleted.

But you are comfortable to say you are fully in support of everything they support too? Including a prominent professor's definition of a woman being someone who takes a passive role in sex and undertakes reproductive role in economic life.

Because, we can start bringing the evidence like that to the thread. Happy to. Just because this woman has some pretty hard line views on what her pastor should be preaching, doesn't mean that any person on this thread needs to agree with her on that.

We do all agree that it is a safeguarding issue to allow a male to be naked and be entering a hot tub within close proximity to either a 9 year old or a 6 year old girl.

Datun · 05/07/2021 13:12

Still yeahbutnaw, i'm glad to see that there is a semblance of dismay from you, in that you are trying to de-fang what this person has done. Albeit by attempting to undermine the woman calling them out.

Presumably, you do actually see the problem involved in pretending that this person is a female, with a female penis.

FijiCavanaugh · 05/07/2021 13:12

Left of right is now extreme right now?

Does that mean Rory Stewart, Ken Clarke and Gordon Brown (left of right and right of left) are basically the same as Bolsonaro, Trump and Le Pen?

Why bother having words that mean things any more?

yeahbutnaw · 05/07/2021 13:08

@Datun receipts?

Datun · 05/07/2021 13:07

@yeahbutnaw

From the viral video woman's Instagram.

Definitely not a false flag op though, right?

What on earth are you talking about? The male bodied person responsible is now saying on Twitter that they will 'fuck you hard' in every legal way. They are admitting that they are the person.

I know you would far rather it hadn't happened because sexual predation is not a good look and I'm sure you are cringing at this person admitting it was them, because their timeline is very telling. Seriously, the memos are flying everywhere, and you're not reading them.

yeahbutnaw · 05/07/2021 13:06

@FijiCavanaugh

Literally no one in the video was denying her claims. If I was in a changing room where nothing happened and then someone started kicking off about there being a penis on show I wouldn't be leaving the changing room with her and also asking for a refund. I'd be ignoring her or maybe supporting the staff. Everyone in the video was either supporting her or telling her Peniston
And then everyone clapped?

Because I didn't see any support for her in the video. Possible you imagined that part?

moreofthisagain · 05/07/2021 13:05

I was commenting on the OP about why celebrities aren’t supporting sexual assault. I’m surprised that anyone would want someone to support men who do this...My comment was in relation to the OP to explain why celebrities are not rushing to support a man who commits a sexual assault. I’m surprised you would expect anyone to defend that? @2021DNA

What do you believe was the sexual assault? I watched the video and I don't recall anything about contact being made? I mean, I think it is a form of sex crime if a man enters a female only changing space and enjoys being naked there and knowing the women/ girls have to accept it and enjoys being able to see them naked whether they wish to be seen naked by him or not.

But how are the women and girls meant to know if that is what is happening or if it is a genuine TW? How can one realistically expect them to have different emotional reactions, to know whether their response is fear/ alarm/ threat/ humiliation, or to be totally ok?

If you are a vocal and public supporter of TWAW this is EXACTLY the sort of case you need to commenting on, as this is a real life example of the implications of TWAW in all circumstances and because they say they are, and yes, those public supporters of TWAW should be entering a conversation on this and yes, it is intellectual and moral cowardice not to.

yeahbutnaw · 05/07/2021 13:05

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FijiCavanaugh · 05/07/2021 13:05

*Penis in the changing room was just fine and dandy.

FijiCavanaugh · 05/07/2021 13:04

Literally no one in the video was denying her claims. If I was in a changing room where nothing happened and then someone started kicking off about there being a penis on show I wouldn't be leaving the changing room with her and also asking for a refund. I'd be ignoring her or maybe supporting the staff. Everyone in the video was either supporting her or telling her Peniston

yeahbutnaw · 05/07/2021 13:03

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334bu · 05/07/2021 13:02

So yeahbutnaw you don't believe this actually happened and if it did, woman complaining is not nice anyway. Obviously you didn't watch the video and didn't see the other women milling about, obviously having vacated the women's section, nor the other women complaining and asking for their money back.
Just for information , what kind of woman is allowed to complain that a male person is naked in a section of a spa dedicated to female clients and their children? Or then again, maybe you see nothing wrong with a random male stranger getting naked in front of women and children?

highame · 05/07/2021 13:02

A major issue for TRA's is that they are aligned in the culture wars in the US and none of them can backtrack on anything. Therefore the chances of any resolution to the rights for women is, at least for now, not possible. This culture war is being fought be two extreme views and is dragging everyone in the reasonable camp to take sides. This is the intention. Queer and CRT theories need the dissolution of boundaries and laws, it is part of the cause. One these theories start to be tested out in material reality, they collapse. As wider society becomes aware, more pushback will happen. My fear is that it will detrimentally affect the LGBT community. I want protection of women's rights. I do not want discrimination of LGBT community to return.

Whatwouldscullydo · 05/07/2021 13:02

Lots have that opinion. I dont have to agree with everything a person says or thinks to think that they deserve the same rights to penis free spaces as other women.

I dont like Donald trump but I'm.not gonna argue that the sky is green just to avoid agreeing with him on something.

We have seen the.likes of several males post videos akd photos in.swimmimg pools, toilets, changing rooms, shelters.

We know it happens and jt didn't just have have happen.to someone we like or agree with to believe its just down right wrong

GromblesofGrimbledon · 05/07/2021 13:02

@yeahbutnaw

I lean right of centre. Using this as an insult doesn't wash with me in the slightest.

HecatesCatsInFancyHats · 05/07/2021 13:00

yeahbutnaw - 'Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation involving distorting the truth in order to confuse or instill doubt in another person to the point they question (their sanity or) reality.'

GromblesofGrimbledon · 05/07/2021 13:00

It's incredible to me that there are people who are so ardent about trans rights to the detriment of anyone else's rights, that they will quite literally defend sexual predators and deviants to further their cause. As a PP said, "it never happens and if it does, well it's not as bad as you say it is."

Apparently trans people can do no harm, and there are never sexual deviants who will happily abuse the current push for trans rights to force themselves into women and girls' spaces.

I don't buy it.

yeahbutnaw · 05/07/2021 13:00

@JediGnot

Great to see you using the same arguments as Trump with the Skittles analogy.

www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37416457

You consistently find yourself in right-wing company. Strange that.