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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Am I non binary?

190 replies

YesClemFandango · 29/06/2021 17:05

Not a TAAT but it got me thinking.... Am I non-binary? I reject gender stereotypes. I would prefer a neutral title (working on it!). I wear clothes that could be considered typically masculine or feminine. To be honest at my age I'd feel a bit odd calling myself non-binary, but I wonder if it's short hand for how my peers understand my views (I'm a student)? How can I check?

OP posts:
jellyfrizz · 01/07/2021 14:47

@DadJoke

How to find out if you are non-binary:

First step - if you truthfully answer "yes" to the question "are you a woman?" then you are not non-binary.

Gender identity is not gender expression. Being gender non-confirming says nothing whatsoever about your gender identity.

Thinking "I'm a woman because I'm female, gender identity is nonsense" does not make you non-binary. If you don't believe gender identity exists, you are not non-binary, because if you were, you'd damn well know it exists.

Who made you the gender police?
Wallpapering · 01/07/2021 14:36

I’ve got to brush up interviews skills, always hated dread question ‘so tell me about yourself’ as always want to say what fuck you want to know -am cagey as fuck & autistic-

So now can I just answer that question with I’m non binary or any other wanky shit label this would help that awkwardness I get.

Although just hope don’t ask me to elaborate on it.

chickenyhead · 01/07/2021 14:30

I don't understand ConfusedBlush

How do you work out your gender identity if it isn't based on gender expression?

What you are saying is that I could be a woman (sex), who identifies as a man (gender identity) but who wears high heels, lipstick and dresses (gender expression)?

How do us oldies work out who we are in this system?

DadJoke · 01/07/2021 14:21

How to find out if you are non-binary:

First step - if you truthfully answer "yes" to the question "are you a woman?" then you are not non-binary.

Gender identity is not gender expression. Being gender non-confirming says nothing whatsoever about your gender identity.

Thinking "I'm a woman because I'm female, gender identity is nonsense" does not make you non-binary. If you don't believe gender identity exists, you are not non-binary, because if you were, you'd damn well know it exists.

Cailleach1 · 01/07/2021 12:40

Well, I'm a very unique and special non-binary. Not you common lot. I identify as a king gender. Even queenie was only born into it. I have an identity of monarch.

Of course, all are bigoted towards me. This bigotry seems so accepted and widespread; even mumsnet deleted my announcement and disrespected my brave coming out as my true authentic self. Sad

PaleGreenGhost · 01/07/2021 11:50

@Avocadowoman

I think ‘non-binary’ is a bit like choosing a really expensive drink or meal when you expect the bill to be shared.

It only ‘works’ if not everyone does it and it annoys everyone else even if they don’t say anything.

Utter genius analogy.
MrGHardy · 01/07/2021 11:39

Sure, we are all part of the alphabet soup, personally I am NB and pan.

ArabellaScott · 01/07/2021 09:41

I think some of these ideas are usefully classified as brain farts, tbh.

ArabellaScott · 01/07/2021 09:40

Sounds like Schrodigender, Justme. Which I have a dim memory of being a thing.

Justme56 · 01/07/2021 09:34

I'm non-binary too. There are so many different genders to choose from and whilst at first I was drawn to 'leather gender', based mainly on my ever growing collection of Radley handbags, I eventually settled with quoigender, ‘someone who is done with gender and doesn’t care much for it as a concept’ (nonbinary wiki). Surprising that I need to have a gender to not believe in gender - who knew!!!

TheElementsSong · 01/07/2021 08:28

@Avocadowoman

I think ‘non-binary’ is a bit like choosing a really expensive drink or meal when you expect the bill to be shared.

It only ‘works’ if not everyone does it and it annoys everyone else even if they don’t say anything.

That's an excellent analogy! I'm going to remember that for when I want to annoy my teens Grin
EightiesRobot · 01/07/2021 08:27

When you're in your teens and 20s it's natural to seek out your 'tribe' of like-minded individuals to express your individuality. But I guess you always get older goths, teddy boys etc. I still have vague ideas of myself as an indie kid but don't feel the need to identify as one socially.

Avocadowoman · 01/07/2021 08:21

I think ‘non-binary’ is a bit like choosing a really expensive drink or meal when you expect the bill to be shared.

It only ‘works’ if not everyone does it and it annoys everyone else even if they don’t say anything.

toffeebutterpopcorn · 01/07/2021 08:15

Just imagine explaining sex and gender to say, an alien from the planet Zog where where are 1 or 100 sexes (actual no ‘feel’).

JuneDays · 01/07/2021 08:02

Do you have a gender identity? Do you reject the gender identity of woman and man, but still have a sense of gender identity that isn't based on those genders? If so, then yes, non-binary.

If you have no sense of gender identity and feel more non-conformist with stereotypes for women, then you're a woman who rejects societal expectations.

Nothing wrong with either.

WarriorN · 01/07/2021 08:01

Not read thread but why do we need labels for a wide range of clothes and personality?

All NB means in real terms is bind/ cut your breasts off if you're female and wear makeup if you're male.

Again, still more damaging to women than men.

colettesidonie · 01/07/2021 08:01

Honestly this is probably not the best forum to ask that question, because you'll get a bunch of replies mocking the entire concept.

If you feel that you don't identify as male or female, then it's OK to identify as nonbinary. Try out the label and see if it fits.

There's lots of good resources on the internet to learn more about what nonbinary means. Here's one from Teen Vogue that's pretty good: www.teenvogue.com/story/9-things-people-get-wrong-about-being-non-binary

And for anyone who says that only teenagers identify as nonbinary ... there's plenty of us older nonbinary folks.

toffeebutterpopcorn · 01/07/2021 07:55

How on earth would a gender label make one iota of difference in anyone’s life? Sex matters but outward presentation and preferences (clothes, hobbies, activities) does not.

NewlyGranny · 01/07/2021 07:42

On reflection, I've always been "gender non-conforming" because I have opinions, routinely challenge authority, think for myself and have never done anything because I was supposed to. I have worked in a deeply subversive field all my life and I can't stop now.

None of this has ever, ever made me question my sex or prevented me from experiencing the good, and sometimes the bad, of being a woman, not for a moment.

I don't get what people mean when they talk about "feeling" like a woman or a man. I just feel like the person I am: human, I guess.

I think gender stereotypes are pernicious and I hoped we'd got past perpetuating them for the generations that came after us second wave feminists, but no: you turn around and there they are in all their ghastly extremes, tearing young lives apart and sowing unnecessary conflict and division between people who could and should be working together.

I could weep.

Shehasadiamondinthesky · 01/07/2021 07:08

Why do people need to label themselves all the time, I think it's a form of gross attention seeking and to be honest nobody else could care less.
I'm a biker, have a job where I work with all men and can handle myself in any situation but I'm just me.

NewlyGranny · 01/07/2021 07:02

Eschew labels. Ignore gender stereotypes. Wear what you feel comfortable in. Develop your own interests. Work hard for your goals. Make and keep good friends. Refuse to get bogged down in arcane questions. Enjoy your life. All will become clear.

NotYourCisterinAus · 01/07/2021 04:05

I don't know, OP. Do you have brightly dyed hair and a septum piercing? If not, probably not. Smile

Seriously, I've thought for a while that the way to kill this non-binary fad off would be for us boring, middle-aged "oldies" to adopt the label. As far as I can work out, a "non-binary" is supposed to be someone that doesn't "feel like" a man or a woman, and I'm probably not far wrong in saying that all of us can claim that. And if we did, it would make non-binary seriously uncool.

NiceGerbil · 01/07/2021 02:21

How this translates for all the different countries cultures in the world is also...

Never addressed at all.

NiceGerbil · 01/07/2021 02:20

We have to be cisgender, most people do, unless it all falls apart.

The idea that misgendering is awful does not apply when it's people who disagree. Esp women.

If everyone is trans then... What then?

The biggest kick in the face of all is that women who do not conform to stereotype. Have fought against them. Have gone through life feeling they're missing something that everyone else seems to understand. Feel out of place.

And so want to free people from prescribed sex roles/ gender norms. And not to mention the massive harm caused by them all over the world.

Are TOLD we're c*s.

If a woman says no I'm not.

Then.. she's wrong. She is NOT allowed to identify as she wishes and have that respected.

I mean it's just all so obviously regressive sexist nonsense.

With a side helping of wanting to destroy everything that women have fought for, so hard, for s long long time.

chickenyhead · 01/07/2021 02:05

But how can we be cisgender without a gender identity to match?

It feels like a word game. Used to bully women over a certain age, who have no agenda to identify as anything other than themselves.

Why has the world gone mad with this. Why are laws being made that put women again in last place?