Laurel Hubbard is the beginning of the end of women’s sports

www.skysports.com/other-sports/news/11095/12311168/sky-sports-and-bbc-sport-stars-unite-to-fight-against-online-abuse-in-hate-wont-win-video

In the light of well-intentioned campaigns like this, I am concerned about how media commentators will be constrained when talking about the participation of Hubbard and other male athletes taking female Olympic places, with dissenting viewpoints being potentially framed as 'hate' rather than a desire for fair play.

This is where I saw the number 9:

www.outsports.com/2021/5/12/22428082/trans-olympic-athlete-tokyo-ioc-paralympic

I read about it this morning. Totally unacceptable. And unfair.

Finally a sensible piece from the guardian on this ..

www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2021/jun/22/by-conflating-gender-and-sex-we-undermine-sporting-competition

@zafferana
I think la lot of people - my DH thought TWAW is just men who want to wear women’s clothes make up and live as a women and don’t really pose any meaningful threat to women .

When its seen in the way of sports especially it seems to hit that little switch that goes WTF WTF the sports thing is something men can get and understand as it’s something they relate to .
He’s now asking me how many women who want to be men try to get into men’s sport 😂😂

timeisnotaline

Hubbard competes for New Zealand, not Australia, population is less than half a million, not sure what proportion are females old enough to compete in the Olympics; but fondofbeetles is a scientist, so I'll trust her stats.

Money and notoriety I guess

Hubbard's father is a billionaire. A white, billionaire's child, who has spent most of their life living as a privileged (in the real sense, not the bullshit BLM sense), white male. Has pushed out of competition young, indigenous women, whose chances of another crack at the Olympics may be slim to none. Motives? What sort of person in their position would do this to those women? Someone with Hubbard's resources could be the first trans woman to do any number of things - hell, book a place into space with Elon Musk - if they wanted the fame/notoriety. But no, they trample on the hopes and dreams of disadvantaged females of colour. I know what I think the motives are.

I can only hope that a lot of people who have felt similar to my DH get their lightbulb moment

Me too. I'm delighted though that all the crap recently being thrown at women has turned both my DH and DS1 into GC feminists. They suddenly get it and that's what we need - not just women yelling about stuff, because who the f* listens to us - we need men, male allies in this fight.

EmbarrassingAdmissions

Majorfluff
Think there is a couple more trans athletes going to Tokyo.

9 known, iirc.

So that’s 9 women who have now missed out.

My DH who isn’t been very aware of the TWAW debate is shouting at the tv
“ He He “
Me & the dog thought he was watching some weird interactive tv show .
Then I realised he was angrily shouting at the tv where they are talking about LH competing in the Olympics -
My DH is shouting at the tv that “it’s a he not a she” - he even said he noticed that LH armpits has more hair than he has and he is struggling to get his head around this how he is able to compete in the woman’s category 😂😂

His brain is really hurting him at the moment .

As a male who has competed in high level MMA & boxing for many years he’s been in a right strop since watching this on tv today mumbling WTF is going on and he is suddenly starting to understand what I’ve been telling him for ages .
Previously he was well if they aren’t hurting anyone why are you getting so annoyed - now it’s like a little lights gone on in his head and he actually gets what the problem is .

I can only hope that a lot of people who have felt similar to my DH get their lightbulb moment

Out of pure curiosity, I would be really interested to know Jacinda Ardern's real views on this as her statement could be read two ways, as 'them's the rules, nothing to argue about, it's all fair and square', or 'those are the rules, nothing has technically been done wrong so I'm not in a position to really say anything otherwise'.

I saw someone argue on Twitter that it's OK because at least those who are placed second, third have 'had the opportunity to compete in the Olympics' and therefore haven't been denied anything. It's crazy the mental gymnastics at play here.

That’s because men can become women but women can’t even register as human.

Smugness, maybe.

Plenty of men seem to think that physical strength somehow = moral superiority over women.

Think there is a couple more trans athletes going to Tokyo.

This awful, completely ridiculous that this should be allowed.

What satisfaction could Hubbard even feel from taking a medal?

They are not achieving a thing !

I see the argument for the women athletes all refusing to compete but I hope they won't. That's partly because they've all trained and worked so long and hard for Tokyo and deserve to show what they can do; it's also because the IOC need to know who to give the medals to when all this nonsense is over and Hubbard is retrospectively disqualified.

I wouldn't advise women to compete against transwomen in contact team sports like rugby or ring events like boxing or wrestling, though, just because of the massively increased risk of life changing or fatal injuries like spinal or skull fractures or crush injuries. It's a good cause but it shouldn't take a martyr to endorse it.

As a PP suggests, retired sportspeople of both sexes are best placed to create the publicity and steer the discussion s they have less to lose.

At 1pm on Sunday 27th June Kellie Jay Keen ("Posie Parker") is going to stand outside the New Zealand embassy with a stepladder, a loudhailer and a banner to protest that Laurel Hubbard has denied a deserving sportswoman a place in the Olympics. And will probably steal a woman's medal.

It would be great if people who care about women's sports could go along to support her.

Laurel Hubbard is representing New Zealand time so from an even smaller population.

From a country that promotes fair play as being the most important aspect of sport - every Kiwi child is taught this from a young age - this is especially awful.

I’ve mentioned it before but there should be an argument made for a female athlete to use testosterone to bring her levels up to that of a trans women taking hormones, as a level playing field. An older, previously retired athlete could make this argument. Not cause it has any merit but because it makes the point.

Now, none of those women have ever been in their 40s. Most are 20s. So the probability is more like 1/100,000,000. Hubbard is approx 1000 x more likely to be struck by lightning. Assuming that example got the lightning probability right. Obviously I’m approximating but australia is not especially populous so not a terrible example.