Debunking trans teen suicide stats

And, for those tragedies that do occur, it's an appalling litany of multiple failures in service provision.

Correction to that, I omitted "all too often an appalling…"

Prof. Appleby and the Manchester report are excellent.

My objections are with reports based on survey data for which the raw data and methodology are withheld.

@ShagMeRiggins

It was always considered a mental health condition until the WHO changed their categorisation in 2019. They decided they should remove the ‘mental health’ stigma.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-48448804

Anorexia, otoh, is still considered a mental health condition (by the NHS anyway, can’t find WHO)

www.nhs.uk/mental-health/conditions/anorexia/overview/

As both are a disconnect between mind and body, how does that work?

The very sad cases of child suicide/deaths that I can remember in the news are often said to be caused by bullying (the usual shitty type) or teens acting out dangerous sex games (where are they seeing this) or taking recreational drugs.

Why aren’t schools really focussing on all this? Why is so much time and money being spent purely on one part of the LGB+ community. Small but influential. So many kids/young adults would self describe themselves as under the umbrella these days because - well that’s what they do, even if they don’t actually understand it.

Child suicides are thankfully rare in UK.

Gender dysphoria is not a mental health condition in itself

sites.manchester.ac.uk/ncish/reports/suicide-by-children-and-young-people/

This is the National Confidential Inquiry into Suicide which includes a brief section on LGBT children and young people. I understand the current ongoing audit is more specifically asking questions about whether someone was trans rather than LGBT and there is a link to the full report which is worth reading.
The report is a sad read I'm afraid, all families with lost young people.

The sooner the authors of every report that is based on YouGov or similar survey data have to release a clear protocol and methodology the better.

Every one of these appalling assertions should be scrutinised before they're allowed onto MSM - and if they're known to be wrong then interviewers need to be challenging them.

We're all aware of the Samaritans guidance in this area - why aren't these spokespeople and MSM taking it to heart?

These might be internal issues around gender dysphoria, or external ones such as bullying or other adverse experiences they may have as a result of their gender identity.

Or it could be that the vast majority of their patients have multiple adverse childhood experiences (such as cse, neglect, mental health issues with parents etc), a generally chaotic lifestyle and/or they have autism, a condition which can high levels of mental health issues especially anxiety.

Seriously, the sooner DfE and OFSTED denounce affirmation as a safeguarding issue the better. Adults are harming children, no matter their good intentions, and it needs to stop.

From a GIDS press release:

Tragically, there is a higher risk of self-harm and suicidal ideation or attempts found in LGBT communities compared to their cisgender or straight peers. Suicidality in young people attending the GIDS is similar to that of young people referred to child and adolescent mental health services. It is not helpful to suggest that suicidality is an inevitable part of this condition. Gender dysphoria is not a mental health condition in itself and we work hard with young people to ensure they can work out any issues they have around their gender identity while feeling supported. These might be internal issues around gender dysphoria, or external ones such as bullying or other adverse experiences they may have as a result of their gender identity. Our focus is on supporting young people to be resilient and positive and many of the young people we see are doing very well. It is important to note that it would be very unusual for younger children referred to the service to make suicidal attempts.

gids.nhs.uk/news-events/2018-10-15/our-response-full-itv-series-butterfly

Although it's GIDS and we know what they are like at collecting data 🤷‍♀️

genderreport.ca/finland-strict-guidelines-for-treating-gender-dysphoria/

I think Finland has seen very similar results.

It's worth pointing out that in lovely, progressive Sweden ( a country that has been at the forefront of trans rights for years) they had a 65% drop in referrals to gender clinics back in 2019.

There has been no corresponding spike in suicide. Pretty clear proof that transitioning children does not improve their mental or physical health.

genderreport.ca/the-swedish-u-turn-on-gender-transitioning/

I think the Trevour Foundation has links to stars that show it was a small group of transgender people who self declared for the survey. You could follow up some if the references this link
www.thetrevorproject.org/resources/preventing-suicide/facts-about-suicide/

Also contact Safe Schools Alliance and Transgender Trend about this. And browse their resources pages to help you write letters etc.
www.transgendertrend.com/
safeschoolsallianceuk.net/

fullfact.org/health/young-trans-people/

Not re suicide, but I really like this piece by clinicians in Australia on their concerns that social transition before being seen by a gender identity clinic, creates a fixed mindset in children/adolescents, particularly section 5.2.

I think it’s quite a good piece to discourage schools to be neutral re gender ideology (not that it convinced my daughter’s school but I live in hope that someone will listen to it!)

journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/26344041211010777#.YIc_RaJBvsE.twitter

5.2. Conflation of gender affirmation and medical intervention

The second theme concerned the way in which the gender affirmative model—the dominant sociopolitical discourse—shaped the expectations of the children (and families) presenting to the service (see Section 4.2). It appeared to us that a large subgroup of children equated affirmation with medical intervention and appeared to believe that their distress would be completely alleviated if they pursued the pathway of medical treatment. Very often, we the clinicians felt that our efforts to work from a biopsychosocial perspective, along with our therapeutic efforts to discuss different aspects of the medical situation, fell on deaf ears. Lost were our efforts to highlight the many different pathways in which gender variation could be expressed, to explain potential adverse effects of medical treatment, to explore issues pertaining to future fertility and child rearing, and to highlight the importance of ongoing psychotherapy. With regard to the last item, we had a strong commitment to exploring issues of self and to helping the children both to understand the context in which their own distress (and potential mental health comorbidities) had arisen and to reflect, more generally, on their concerns, expectations, and future prospects. This same overall dynamic also put many parents—who were trying to support their children in a more holistic way but who were aware of potential long-term harms—in a difficult and untenable situation. The drivers of this dynamic appeared to include not simply the gender affirmative model itself but information from peers, previously encountered health workers, and the internet; many children arrived at the clinic with strongly entrenched beliefs and with no interest in further exploring their medical, psychological, social, or familial situation. It also became apparent to us that many children did not have the cognitive, psychological, or emotional capacity to understand the decisions they were making (see also Section 7).

If we are a more 'accepting society' why then is transitioning not happening across all age ranges and both sexes in equal amounts? Is she saying that teenage girls and older men are more accepting than the rest of us?

It looks like you're reconciled to not making any progress, at least in the short term. However, if you've provided reality-based materials that are in conflict with their faith-based beliefs, it might cause some cognitive dissonance which, in time, could lead them to examining their beliefs.

This is the best debunking - it's by Michael Biggs of Oxford University:

www.transgendertrend.com/suicide-by-trans-identified-children-in-england-and-wales/