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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

GMP new chief stands up against wokeness

43 replies

CervixSampler · 14/06/2021 13:38

GMP's new chief constable 'absolutely would not' take the knee www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/gmps-new-chief-constable-absolutely-20807814

I know the article states it's about taking the knee but there's a great quote further down:

"Stephen Watson believes the level of 'woke' policing has passed a 'high water mark' of tolerance from the public, who would rather see officers catch burglars.

He said the public is 'fed up' with 'virtue-signalling police officers' and believes that the impartiality of officers could be undermined by responses to campaign groups including actions such as taking the knee or wearing their pins, badges or rainbow shoelaces."

Am I right in thinking the campaign groups he speaks of are likely to include Stonewall?

The tide is changing and quickly it seems.

I appreciate there is a lot in that article but from a FWR point of view I'm taking it as a positive and hoping that GMP improve. The same GMP who classed marital rape as "not very nice but not a crime," when I reported my exH. And that was a female detective who said that.

OP posts:
FloppyHoldsNoTruckWithFrontedA · 14/06/2021 18:22

"The police should act without fear not favour. They take an oath to act impartially."
is there any chance you could link? Sadly my abuser is one of them (hence bravery of his colleague) and I think he has used this very wording........
Apologies for derail.

FloppyHoldsNoTruckWithFrontedA · 14/06/2021 18:20

"by encouraging the opposite of hate!""

no. I think that's where we go wrong. As Orwell noted with his Ministry of Love.
police officers are not there to be our friends. Nor are doctors, nor are judges. They have roles in society.

BaronessWrongCrowd · 14/06/2021 18:19

The police should act without fear not favour. They take an oath to act impartially. Doesn’t matter who they deal with, they should not prioritise one group or another. They are there to uphold the law. Not be actively pro anyone.

FloppyHoldsNoTruckWithFrontedA · 14/06/2021 18:18

"I don't really know, but surely part of their job - preventing and solving crime - is to dissuade hate crimes by encouraging the opposite of hate!"

But isn't it utterly extraordinary that we don't know? It's all very well us having individual views about what the police force is and what it does but surely everyone ought to know from primary school onwards? otherwise how can we engage with this powerful force in our lives?

DaisiesandButtercups · 14/06/2021 18:15

@JediGnot

I have mixed feelings about this. The police - as the "force" of a democratic state - should be actively pro LGBT rights and anti-racism. Equally they should not get into the politics of BLM, or into anything about LGBT rights beyond "we are here to serve everyone in society, everyone deserves respect and equality as an individual".

This obviously presents problems - to what extent is a rainbow flag an LGB equality symbol, and to what extent does it represent the current TRA insanity?

To your last point, I don’t think it matters. I don’t think that police officers (or others in the public sector) should be displaying any symbols or flags, they should be entirely impartial and apolitical. They need to be able to connect with and build relationships of trust with everyone in this country. As soon as you show support for one group or cause you automatically alienate others or at least make them wonder why their group or cause is less important than the one being visibly supported.
GreyhoundG1rl · 14/06/2021 18:14

Because everyone should be treated equally and with respect in a democratic society.
I totally agree.

But this should be done without elevating one group above all others, which is of course the polar opposite of equality.

JediGnot · 14/06/2021 18:12

@FloppyHoldsNoTruckWithFrontedA

"The police - as the "force" of a democratic state - should be actively pro LGBT rights Why?"

What are the police for, constitutionally I mean? I understand they have an overriding duty to investigate crime, but how does their community cohesion/community interaction/fostering of good relations stuff work?

I have been directly affected by this - I think - in that a police force that seemed indifferent to my plight (save for one brave female officer) contacted me a week after Sarah Everard's death to ask if I would support an application for a restraining order against the abusive man in my life. "My" officer hadn't changed but it seemed as though some new policy had been handed down (as happens in schools,etc) after Sarah's death that gave "my" officer more power.

I don't really know, but surely part of their job - preventing and solving crime - is to dissuade hate crimes by encouraging the opposite of hate!
JediGnot · 14/06/2021 18:11

@GreyhoundG1rl

The police - as the "force" of a democratic state - should be actively pro LGBT rights Why?
Because everyone should be treated equally and with respect in a democratic society.

To be clear - being pro trans rights is about not bullying trans people, instead treating them with respect in person - I am not saying that the political aspects of the insane TRA movement shoule be included in LGBT rights that the police support.

FloppyHoldsNoTruckWithFrontedA · 14/06/2021 18:06

..... so "GMP new chief stands up against wokeness" can't really be right. If the chief has the power to make these decisions, he's just made a decision to change the culture and is changing it.
If he doesn't have that power, or has a discretion, it's a bit different.

But the police chief doesn't "stand up to" anyone. Individual brave officers do - but they are standing up to their own bosses and trying to be true to their mission, surely?

FloppyHoldsNoTruckWithFrontedA · 14/06/2021 18:03

"The police - as the "force" of a democratic state - should be actively pro LGBT rights
Why?"

What are the police for, constitutionally I mean? I understand they have an overriding duty to investigate crime, but how does their community cohesion/community interaction/fostering of good relations stuff work?

I have been directly affected by this - I think - in that a police force that seemed indifferent to my plight (save for one brave female officer) contacted me a week after Sarah Everard's death to ask if I would support an application for a restraining order against the abusive man in my life. "My" officer hadn't changed but it seemed as though some new policy had been handed down (as happens in schools,etc) after Sarah's death that gave "my" officer more power.

IsThePopeCatholic · 14/06/2021 18:00

The police lost their impartiality when they were prepared to put the boot in during the miners’ strike of the 1980’s. Many of us with long memories have never forgotten nor forgiven their willingness to be Thatcher’s boot boys.

FloppyHoldsNoTruckWithFrontedA · 14/06/2021 18:00

gosh this is tricky. There is such a risk of being caught in a bad backlash.

as to taking the knee I greatly admired the sportsman who began it in the US. It was his deeply felt protest and he suffered for it.

These things have an authentic moment but once they are organised and people who aren't affected join in, that moment passes. It can degrade the meaning of the original protest and oddly becomes disrespectful.

GreyhoundG1rl · 14/06/2021 17:55

The police - as the "force" of a democratic state - should be actively pro LGBT rights
Why?

JediGnot · 14/06/2021 17:52

I have mixed feelings about this. The police - as the "force" of a democratic state - should be actively pro LGBT rights and anti-racism. Equally they should not get into the politics of BLM, or into anything about LGBT rights beyond "we are here to serve everyone in society, everyone deserves respect and equality as an individual".

This obviously presents problems - to what extent is a rainbow flag an LGB equality symbol, and to what extent does it represent the current TRA insanity?

CervixSampler · 14/06/2021 17:21

I don't do Twitter but I imagine there might be some tantrums outrage about this.
It's been very sunny lately hasn't it . I do love sunshine. It's excellent for one's mental health 😎

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SpringCrocus · 14/06/2021 16:48

I felt quietly optimistic, reading what he said

ChristinaXYZ · 14/06/2021 16:28

I think it is a really important statement too.

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 14/06/2021 16:11

This was a really important statement. Officers are entitled to their private views but on duty they have to be seen to be impartial.