What right to a single sex space do I have and how?

I'd say in all cases zero effect, they intend to break the law, commit a crime that's acknowledged to be the most heinous crime anyone can commit. Save child murder. A law banning trans women wouldn't even stop trans pedophiles, the current laws don't stop predatory male pedophiles at all. We just need them to be caught as soon as possible, ideally before they offend from their online activity.

All it does is serve to equate trans people with pedophiles, demonise an already demonised minority, and distract from the real problem - cisgender men who are the vast majority of male pedophiles.

There is a never ending list, constantly being added to, of transwomen committing sex offences in women's toilets, on porn hub. Some of them in full view of women and children.

The case I am thinking of was where a social worker waited outside while the girl was assaulted in the toilet.
The obvious solution is they should not have been there.
And one rape is one too many. You can't effectively police who's good trans and who's pretending. just like men. O don't see Dh clamouring to get in the ladies because he's a good guy. Has a crb too. Doesn't mean we let him into women's spaces though.

I'm afraid I haven't had time to read all five pages of this thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating a previously-asked question.

What's the legal and the real-life situation of a group or organisation that is holding a lesbian-only event? (I say real-life because I think we'll all recognise that what happens on the ground can be very different from the strictly legal situation)

I am starting to plan a big lesbian party for a friend's birthday early next year. There'll be a live band and then a DJ and the venue can take 250 people (Covid allowing, obviously). There'll be 150+ women who'll be personally invited, but we may also consider quietly promoting it to friends of friends on social media too. What right do we have on the night to turn away any male-sexed people who turn up? This will be a private event, so I assume that as the person who organised it I can say no to anyone.

What if we were to run it as a commercial lesbian-only event with tickets? Are we allowed to define what a lesbian is (same-sex attracted adult human female) and refuse anyone who doesn't appear to fit that description? What if someone with a beard turns up, swears they're a lesbian and that they have a GRC — but won't show it to us because it's discriminatory of us to ask for it?

Please tell me, what difference will it make to a predatory pedophile? A "law" saying no trans women allowed in the loo?

80 odd million people in the US, and 700 odd million people worldwide live in countries with self ID for trans people. Not one statistic on increase in voyerism, assault, nothing. For the very obvious reason - those laws don't enable criminals.

We're not in the US.
In the UK there. Have been assault in prison and little girls raped in toilets.

• Two examples, a third unknown.

Again rare exceptions. And the offenders are and should be being dealt with.

The rest is just fear mongering against a minority group.*

I believe it was Katy Montgomery who was discussing on the internet sitting in toilets listening to women pee.

But I see mishy that you have no idea about safeguarding and how that works, but I also see you don't give a crap about some religions where they are unable to share spaces we with the opposite sex. You are not inclusive at all.

Blue I have genuine sympathy for you, you have been thrown under a bus and women are now extremely angry with the recent onslaught and are pushing back very hard which may or may not end up affecting you.

Given all the usual scaremongering over trans people in bathrooms/changing rooms is kicking off. I'd just like to point out there's peer reviewed evidence on this. In the US no increase in assault, voyerism, etc was found from trans inclusive policies. Police were asked in all states where trans people get to use the right spaces - none were able to find a single incident after those inclusive laws were passed... It's cisgender men that are the problem, they don't seem to need to pretend to be trans (Maybe half a dozen incidents worldwide where they have). I'm part of that group - cisgender men - which is far from a minority - but nothing proposed to stop these assaults would even slightly inconvenience me. It won't even slightly inconvenience the cisgender men who assault women, the one or two out of millions () of men who are prone to assault women by "pretending" to be trans, just won't pretend to be trans that day. What's proposed (Bathroom laws against trans people), will serve to drive them out of public life. I always find that very weird.
link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs13178-018-0335-z

Of course arguably it is their "choice" to share with the opposite sex. The reverse isn't the case - there's no consent.

Transmen must be very vulnerable in the men's. The "use single sex spaces according to gender" makes transmen less safe. What do those advocating that policy say about that?

*attacked even

I would like to see stats and news articles of transwomen being attached in men's toilets. It would be great if there were also stats on gay or disabled men being attached or men from an ethnic / racial minority.
Since transgender identity is a protected category under hate crime legislation (unlike sex) - there should be some way of pulling up fairly representative stats.

But that's illegal. You ought to report that.

Or... Perhaps Mishi and Blue could come on and tell us all that we're wrong and should allow xyz specific definition of male bodied people into women's single sex spaces then refuse to engage with the questions which expose why their views are not fair, workable or often legal.

And we could all get worked up and upset and wonder why this keeps happening when we're convinced we have perfectly valid points and noone can tell us why we're wrong, just that we are wrong!

It's how I imagine gas-lighting makes you feel.

I’ve never heard of any and I think most men would be insulted at the idea that they would immediately attack a trans woman on sight.

It happens and remarkably common. I have been attacked multiple times.

Short answer - you can't. Unless we all show some sort of ID and have police out the front of each toilet.

A GRC is irrelevant to womens space access per the EA Act 2010.

Excellent clarification. Hence why the only logical and workable position is to build public and parliamentary support to exclude all males from women's single-sex spaces and services. No exceptions.

Third spaces are available for anyone and everyone to use. It's not for just trans people - Lots of people hate shared spaces and might like a private, self-contained unit for changing etc. And adequate public funding provided to have trans specific services in addition to female specific services.

What would distinguish a male on male attack on a transwoman in a male toilet from a male on male attack on a male with a disability or other protected characteristic?

Perhaps Mishy could post links to incidents of trans women attacked in male toilets.

I’ve never heard of any and I think most men would be insulted at the idea that they would immediately attack a trans woman on sight.

Rather like the murder stats, I wonder if this problem has also been exaggerated.

And Mishi no of course I don't want all of society segregated. I live with two males, that would be tricky to boot them out.

I do want spaces where women and children are vulnerable to have safeguards in place.

When a woman is getting undressed I want her to feel safe that no male bodied person will be able to enter and stare at her.

When a woman is getting on a bus fully dressed with shopping I think it's fair enough that the seat next to her be sat in by a man. Any woman who is unhappy with this needs to make her own separate provisions, ie drive / walk.

To me that's pretty obvious in a civilised society. I'm amazed you see it differently.

So if we did somehow decide that Blue's solution of permitting access to opposite sex spaces to post op GRC holders only - no other trans people - was workable - & it isn't...

...then MishyJDI won't be very happy.

& if we accepted MishyJDI's frankly risible claim that there's no risk to letting any man who identifies as a woman into female spaces, Blue won't be happy, lots more of the 5000 GRC holders won't be happy & more importantly an awful lot of the millions of women the spaces are actually intended for won't be happy.

I'm going to go with: adult & juvenile human females are the only people who should be in single sex female spaces.

& a proportionate solution to where this leaves any & all unhappy males AND women who want to share with them, is the provision of unisex facilities alongside.

It seems to me that this would be most workable, safest, & keep the largest number of people happy overall.

If we’re going to let men in then let’s just let all men in, after all most men aren’t attackers.

We already know that butch women being challenge in the toilets for appearing to me trans is a problem.

It is a problem, you say. That is a pretty big statement. I wonder if it really is.

Ok. Maybe back to the op's question.

Mishi so you don't think there should be any single sex spaces for women anywhere because not all men are dangerous?

And safeguarding for children... Should DBSs not exist because most teachers / scout leaders are nice? Let's wait until a caretaker attacks a child before checking out their background?

OK, at least you're consistent in your views.
I'll respectfully disagree that they're the best way to run a society.