Heads up: MNHQ planning to create a sex/gender topic separate from FWR.

What a terrible idea

I hope they don't, one of the things I love about the forum is the range of subjects and opinions. And yes the often heated discussions, that's what it's about isn't it?

There are people who have feminism hidden because they don’t want to see endless threads about Glinner, JK Rowling or Maya and so on. However they might be interested in a thread about, I don’t know, girls take-up of maths A-level but would miss out on it.

I've never quite understood why it's a feminist-exclusive issue, since it doesn't just affect feminists, especially now.

Not having a separate board for GC/GI discussions has allowed the claim that it's just intolerant feminists against trans people.

If MNHQ really are going to split the board, I'd like to see the topic moved out of the Feminist section entirely.

(Please give your daughter a little hug from me - it an awful experience)

As far as I'm concerned, feminism is about sex and gender. This sounds like a nonsensical, unworkable idea that will make people even more nervous of posting than they are already, and will also make life even more difficult for Mumsnet moderators.

I was actually thinking that might be a more sensible way to split things. Have a GC feminism board, and a lib-fems board?

I wouldn’t mind that.

I imagine most posters will simply move from FWR to the GC board.

My DD3 is 12. Yesterday she had a group of boys crowding around her, asking if she'd 'fucked '. Does anyone think that didn't happen because she's female?

Having said all that above, if/when this does happen, it will be extremely interesting to watch how it plays out. My prediction is that initially it will become populated by those who've not fully understood the debate (not supposed to be condescending, this was me in the recent past). I think that it could start to become dominated by an anti woman agenda and some of those who were keen to see the back of the not-so-fun feminists might get a first hand experience of our concerns.

I'm wondering how straightforward it will be to appreciate the nuance of gendered roles and expectations (FWR) and gender ideology (whatever the other board is), especially when the latter involves removing human rights from women?

How will this not constantly wrongfoot posters? It's difficult enough for people to understand the special rules here already.

Separating the sex/gender topic from the rest of the Feminist board, that is!

So not actual feminists then?
The biggest threat to women is the erosion of their sex based rights. Giving anyone who self identifies as a woman access to single sex toilets, hospital wards, women’s refuges without thinking about how this can potentially impact on the women in need of those services.
Or do you think feminism is something else?

Well I certainly don't think feminism is alienating other women for not sharing 100% of your views.

Or alienating other women for wanting to focus on a different topic.

Or alienating other women who don't want to get involved in the fairly specific MN style of trans debate.

That is a terrible idea!

They could perhaps have a Gender topic so maybe separate LBG and T boards. Then people who believe in a spectrum of genders can discuss them to their heart's content

That sounds very logical to me.

This sounds good to me too

I don't think this has been thought through but I'm willing to be persuaded otherwise by anyone with further info.

What is great about fwr currently is that a lot of posters bring knowledge, experience and critical thinking and are honestly up for debate. Will this decision mean that any criticism or invitation to think more deeply will be banned or told to go to another board? I can't think of a single feminist issue that hasn't been compromised and complicated by the current trans rights activism.

I really really don't want to talk about gender so much. My passions are early childhood, trauma and solutions to male violence. Unfortunately it is impossible not to have to talk about gender ideology in all of these areas.

It is not our fault this is where feminism currently is. I can't imagine having a board for another rights campaign where those with an understanding of the structural inequalities that are the very basis for that rights campaign to even exist are asked to keep their thoughts separate.

Feminism is strongly about disconnecting gender stereotypes from sex

This.

Paraphrasing someone in the site stuff thread. The purpose of this seems to be to distinguish the biggest grassroots, women's rights movement of this century from feminism.

It's not okay and it plays exactly into what anti women activists want.

This makes no sense - you can't discuss feminism without talking about sex and gender. Women have historically been oppressed on the basis of their sex.

This doesn't make sense. MNHQ want the FWR section to enable users to discuss the myriad ways that sex and gender roles affect women.... but they don't want users to discuss sex or gender in FWR?? Huh?

Surely anyone can post on the feminism boards about anything g they believe to be relative to the cause. What can't be controlled (without stifling speech) is the replies and where that conversation evolve to-if it takes a gender critical direction then what?

They could perhaps have a Gender topic so maybe separate LBG and T boards. Then people who believe in a spectrum of genders can discuss them to their heart's content

That sounds very logical to me.