Starmer and the Labour Party Really Cannot Read the Room

LOJ is really sure of himself isn't he? He is absolutely sure that the 'wrong think' of the centre will be turned around. As soon as those pesky boomers bite the dust, the free world will have the delights of Queer theory and CRT and be glad of it. He doesn't accept there is a centre ground.

Keir Starmer is learning the hard way that you cannot ever appease the LOJ faction of Labour. Even after total capitulation he would be sent off to re-education pasture anyway, so he may as well stand and fight.

Fight for the Party.

Fight for female human rights.

Fight for the meaning and legacy of Equality Act 2010, brought in under the last Labour Government.

Bloody fight, man.

merrymouse

It's quite a staggering conclusion to reach after the Hartlepool result. I think another Corbyn type leadership candidate will push Labour even further into the political wilderness, it will appeal to younger voters but the rest of the electorate want something more centrist.

I note the Graun's scintillating political analysis does not touch on what Muslims might think of swimming sessions being separated by gender instead of sex. Not a dicky bird on that.

Yes - he is being compared unfavourably to Corbyn.

merrymouse

I'm not sure understand, do you think the tweet is part of a campaign to get rid of KS so he can be replaced by someone more left wing?

merrymouse

Blimey, you're right. You have a fine political mind. I didn't pick up on that at all.

So, turns out Self-ID proposals don't get Owen and co back, and I doubt they get anyone else on board either!

There's over 3 million UK Muslims and 86% voted Labour in 2019. The party can't afford to lose them.

The purpose of the tweet is to undermine Starmer.

If the self ID announcement was supposed to shore up support from that wing of the party...

Hm, wow, can anyone think of anything? If only there was a hashtag or something, maybe something about LabourLosing a particular demographic that is actually quite a sizeable chunk of the population. That might be quite useful. For insight.

Today, Owen Jones is panicking about Labour losing the British Muslim vote.

twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/1404507099187617798?s=19

Owen says:

Having spent today in Batley, there's no question that Muslim voters there who've voted Labour all their lives are abandoning the party in large numbers.

There's over 3 million UK Muslims and 86% voted Labour in 2019. The party can't afford to lose them.

Hmm, can anyone think of some policies that Labour supports that discriminate against people with particular religious beliefs?

Thought this was apt. Although I appreciate all of the women staying on and fighting...you do have my respect.

Is that A Thing? I hadn't realised.

Why do Momentum types always call him Keith? Do they believe this devastating satire will knock him off his perch? I hope they soon Do Better, because it’s really unfunny.

Starmer looked like he was giving a review of a primary school play while suffering the after-effects of flu medicine.

He's chanting the accepted mantra and praying for death.

Not really. A trans woman with GRC can legally be a woman, and also legally be excluded from women’s sport.

They don't have all the same legal rights as women, so it's a legal fiction with exemptions.

Actually it's the echo chambers on here that can''t read outside of their closeted room..... Keith has it right.

I am going to try this again as I accidentally deleted some of the post.

It is actually really important to look further than biased screen grabs isn't it? It is better to look further than the top line as always. As others have posted.

A bit like stating that one of the founders of Stonewall should get 'educated' about gay and lesbian rights history.

Did we also ever establish whether or not you actually understand what the whole Australian 'fair go' cultural reference was that you used recently?

If the public really thinks that trans women are women they should automatically agree they belong in female sports, prisons etc, but they don’t.

Not really. A trans woman with GRC can legally be a woman, and also legally be excluded from women’s sport.

It isn’t contradictory; it’s the law.

"The best hope of sorting this out is the Conservative party at the moment. They aren’t ‘doing nothing’, but this ideology is so rooted in government after decades of lobbying that it will take years (though the PM could help by standing up at PMQs and saying ‘women are adult human females’, that would get things moving)."

They've been in power since 2015. They haven't sorted it out so far.
At best, they're happy to do little or nothing in the interests of wrecking the Left; at worst, they deliberately engineered the whole thing for the same reason.
That's why I think Conservative women should stay put and keep the pressure up.

"To those saying we should rejoin the Labour Party at this time, it would feel wrong to show support in any way, and I worry for my family and livelihood because I wouldn't be able to keep my mouth shut."

Do you feel able to keep the pressure up while not a party member? I'm firmly of the opinion that doing whatever we can, however small, is better than doing nothing. So we all do what we can.
That's why I think Labour/LibDem/Green etc. women should stay put and keep the pressure up, not resign on principle.

The yougov poll actually indicates that the more information voters have the less supportive they are of trans stuff. And they also indicate a confusion among voters. They appear to hold contradictory ideas. For instance the majority of people in the U.K. agree that “people should be able to self identify as a different gender from the one they were born in.” Brilliant; a resounding success for self id. However, British people also overwhelmingly are against measures that implement self id! The vast majority agree that trans people need to see doctors for a gender dysphoria diagnosis and also that they need to live for two years in the acquired gender. What is going on? U.K. people say they support self id but actually support the status quo.

You can also see this when the question is phrased to include trans women with male parts who haven’t had surgery. There the support for them being in female spaces and female sports radically drops to almost nothing.

I think these polls show the public don’t have a lot of information and are confused about this issue. On the surface , people want to be supportive so they say they support self id. But when you describe what self id actually means in detail - no medical diagnosis of dysphoria, no living as the acquired gender, no surgery - people change their mind. What this shows is it is disingenuous to pluck a random poll result and say “BRITISH PEOPLE THINK TWAW” because to be honest the polls show contradictory thoughts. If the public really thinks that trans women are women they should automatically agree they belong in female sports, prisons etc, but they don’t.

YY this is a great analysis. So tired of all the bullshit spin.

Actually it's the echo chambers on here that can''t read outside of their closeted room..... Keith has it right.

You've posted this multiple times on FWR, and every time it gets debunked.

I will point out that a lot of the policies that the Conservatives are at least making an attempt to unravel did first appear during the coalition years; much of it can be traced directly to the influence of the Lib Dems.

I will also point out that many issues have arisen due to the poor drafting of the EqA2010, (brought in under a Labour government under the influence of the EU) where ‘gender reassignment’, originally as discussed in both the Lords and the Commons as a medical process, apart from rare cases, is now defined in such broad brush terms as it to make it almost meaningless.

ALL parties are culpable in what has happened, and it was all predicted by some parliamentarians at the time of the GRA debates in 2003/4. The EqA arguably just made things even worse.

The best hope of sorting this out is the Conservative party at the moment. They aren’t ‘doing nothing’, but this ideology is so rooted in government after decades of lobbying that it will take years (though the PM could help by standing up at PMQs and saying ‘women are adult human females’, that would get things moving).

Meanwhile, I will continue to talk to my Conservative MP, who has been very helpful and supportive, and I will continue to post thank you cards to Liz, Kemi, Jackie, Rosie, Tonia, and every other parliamentarian who speaks up for women.

Genuinely devastated by this and very worried I will have the option of either spoiling my ballot or voting Tory at the next election.
I have never voted Tory before and on my DM's side come from a strong left line, trade unionists etc. What on earth is KS thinking??
To those saying we should rejoin the Labour Party at this time, it would feel wrong to show support in any way, and I worry for my family and livelihood because I wouldn't be able to keep my mouth shut.