Starmer and the Labour Party Really Cannot Read the Room

I understand your point, too Whatthechicken

I do wonder when that clip was recorded. Does anyone know?

It's odd that Pink News released it. Normally, I'd expect Keir Starmer to release it from his own account. Is Pink News trying to divert attention away from yesterday's interview?

The sad thing is, that having alienated women all over the country, it's STILL NOT ENOUGH for the tra's. Swathes of comments demanding more, like the plant in the little shop of horrors.

I appreciate all of the ‘fight from inside’ posts, I really do and I understand your point. But personally I am not going to pay my subs every month to a party that has just threatened my daughters sex based rights (whether he actually believes it will happen if they come to power or not; with limits, or not at all). The fact it’s been stated in a video with PN just rubs salt into the wounds, especially after the last few days. I will direct my subs to women’s charities instead.

I think right now, hitting them in the pocket through regular monthly subs will be far more effective than fighting from within.

Acceptance without exception - except, apparently, when the self appointed "proper" ones tell the rest of us mere mortals which ones aren't. Because we'd never have noticed by ourselves.

I’d love to see the Labour Party membership numbers over the past couple of years. Is it going up or down? Who is leaving? Who is joining?
More importantly, how has the number of activists changed? Loads of people joined in the Corbyn era but how many actually cared enough to leaflet? And how many were just keyboard warrior virtue-signalling slactivists?

I think part of the problem is the Labour right have shot themselves in the foot. Having cynically weaponised antisemitism to destroy Corbyn with such wilful disregard for old fashioned niceties like logical argument and burden of proof, they've identified themselves with the whole ultra-woke mentality, where all you have to do is politely suggest that there might be some nuance to explore about a sensitive topic rather than THE "RIGHT" ANSWER, to be drowned in outraged cries of "RACIST!", "ANTISEMITE!", "ISLAMOPHOBE!", "TRANSPHOBE!" etc. And once those things are shouted loudly enough, they must be true.

But yes, therein lies the problem, how can anyone tell a transwomen from a pretend transwomen.

Amongst the tweets below the video, is the bombshell that Karen White was not transgender. I'm so confused, because didn't Karen say that Karen was a woman? Isn't that self ID? Can't get my stupid woman brain around it.

Exactly. I'm not going to be made to feel guilty for leaving a party that has treated me like shit. No one would expect black people to stay in a party that was campaigning to rescind anti-racism laws, or gay people to stay in a party fighting to overturn gay marriage. But, of course, we're women so it's our fucking job to serve everyone, even if they treat us like crap? No thanks - that both misogynistic and pointless.

This with bells on.

So who are his advisors?

twitter.com/lachlan_edi/status/1402695635988619274?s=21

As a Labour party member, I absolutely do not want them to "read the room". I don't want them to do what is popular, I want them to do what they believe to be right.

In this instance, op, you don't think they are right ( time will tell if you or the Labour party are right).

I have a degree of sympathy for your view, and I can certainly see it's point, but I never ever want another government that is content to only do what is popular, instead of doing what they believe to be right. After all polls have shown time and time again, that the populace would support the reintroduction of the repellent ( to me) death penalty. Being popular and being morally right can be two different things.

I'm not a one issue voter. My vote goes to those who I think will most benefit the whole of society. So far,nothing I've seen or read persuaded me to vote for any other party but Labour.

He signed a pledge, he just announced in a video that he supports self ID. the idea that he secretly means something else has no basis in fact as far as I can see

If he means something else, he has a funny way of showing it.

That looked like a hostage video to me. I am quite prepared to believe that he does not believe a word of it. But he still said it, no doubt knowing exactly what he was saying. It reads like an attempt to shore up Stonewall. He could have stalled for longer but does not have the ablity.

If you think he is going to turn the Labour Party around, you have another think coming.

cat I admire your optimism, but fear you are being dreadfully naive.

I see no evidence at all that Labour are listening to, or are willing to listen to women on this issue. Letters to MPs go unanswered, the only MP who has spoken out has been subject to awful abuse, women's meetings disrupted and attacked. Labour leadership have been silent.

Just cancelled my direct debit. Had enough.

It was unacceptable and yet it has happened to so many women, and to absolute silence from other Party members,
He signed a pledge, he just announced in a video that he supports self ID. the idea that he secretly means something else has no basis in fact as far as I can see.

Well if I didn't know it before I definitely do now. Labour have lost my vote. My membership got cancelled last year when it was abundantly clear that they didn't know what a woman was.

Such a shame Keir. You're making a real pigs ear of this shit

I wouldn't dream of trying to make anyone feel guilty.

I think that if you were bullied out of the Party on this issue, that is wholly unacceptable.

And I feel very angry on your behalf.

But, even so, I do think this may be the best moment for people to try and help get Labour - the major Opposition Party - back to where it needs to be. In touch with the electorate - not locked in a cave with its members.

I think this is the moment. And if we lose it, we lose it for a long, long time.

Starmer may not be the politicsl genius we need / but he's no fool.

Sadly, the way things stand with Lsbour, the one that replaces him is likely to be a fool.

Incredible, I know. But there you are.

I'm not saying, 'Relax. It'll all be fine.' I wouldn't say that. I'm saying that Starmer is miles from endorsing unlimited self-id in that clip.

If he was miles away from endorsing self id, he wouldn't mention it. He didn't need to talk about it at all.

Why should anyone believe that he doesn't support self id when he went out of his way to talk about it?

KeepPrisons Well, according to TRAs, yes, self-id is everything or nothing.

But does it have to be? No. It doesn't. It can be anything the law decides. It can be an easier process of self-documentation in certain areas, and for certain documents, in certain situations. With exemptions.

It wouldn't make TRAs happy - but it would probably make life easier for enough people.

But ... I'm not Starmer.

For all I know, he has indeed signed up to the full-fat version.

But I somehow doubt it.

The proof of the pudding will be the next manifesto. And that might be quite soon, given we're looking at a 2023 GE, perhaps.

Until then, I still say that now is the moment to join Lsbour and push.

I couldn't listen to more than 15 seconds, is he the most boring person EVER!

He has the charisma of a old dead walrus.

I think you're right, Cat and Warrior

I always come back to the point that Rosie Duffield, Paula Lamont, Kiri Tunks - all those women who have stood up - have not resigned their membership. They're still there, still fighting.

Don't, for heaven's sake, go believing that the Conservatives will say anything different the moment it suits them. Indeed, two or three years ago, it's exactly what they were saying.

This is a cross party problem that we all have to fight. We won't do that by giving up our places of influence within political parties that will set the agenda.

You know, I used to think I should stay in Labour and try to fix it from the inside, but then I thought - if someone shits in your tea, how much time do you spend trying to fish it out before you just think it's time to just bin it and get a different cup of tea?