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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

First 'chat with HR'

154 replies

Iwasonlytryingtohelp · 03/06/2021 15:07

I mentioned LGB Alliance in a conf call (HR director asked for input on which diversity and inclusion external groups to engage with). Someone stated it was a transphobic organisation, so I just said I was happy to discuss off line. Today I have been approached by my HR business partner 'to chat'.

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morningtoncrescent62 · 03/06/2021 16:06

GC = gender critical. Handy shorthand for anyone who is critical of gender identity ideology, the belief that gender identity trumps biological sex. GC people believe that sex is real and politically relevant, and gender is a set of damaging social stereotypes. Lots of different shades of belief are under the GC banner, but I think that's the core. Feel free to disagree, anyone.

Artichokeleaves · 03/06/2021 16:05

You're demonstrating open mindedness, lack of political bias to one group in preference to others, an interest in listening to all voices including the ones stating feeling disenfranchised, not represented, conflicting interests.

Frankly it's a stronger HR position than an unthinking, vigorous I'm a goodie, those are the baddies strongly partisan political position! Don't get manoevered into 'if you're not strongly virtue signalling then you must be bad'. The virtue signalling should be thoroughly questioned and impartiality maintained.

ClawedButler · 03/06/2021 16:04

I've come off twitter because the abuse was making me physically shake with anxiety every time I went on there

morningtoncrescent62 · 03/06/2021 16:03

My fingers are crossed that they're inviting you in to talk about how you think LGB Alliance can help with training and policy formation in your company. FWIW I work in an HR-adjacent role, and there are several GC women in our HR department quietly beavering away behind the scenes trying to prevent and even reverse the worst of the Stonewall-trained nonsense (my company is in the Diversity Champions programme).

UnluckyMe · 03/06/2021 16:03

What is GC? All I can think of is Gemma Collins!

thepuredrop · 03/06/2021 16:02

I'd be seriously tempted to ask that before the meeting you would like HR to speak to the original complainant and have them explain what is transphobic about LGB Alliance

I think don’t mention it unless HR directly refer to it. Go with the suggestion by PPs about LGBA campaigning for same-sex attracted people. If HR raise it, point to Charity Commission’s explanation re awarding LGBA charitable status, expressing your surprise and confusion that they could be considered transphobic.

McDuffy · 03/06/2021 15:59

Such unnecessary stress for you, but see it as an opportunity, too.
I did similar, in that I made myself feel a bit sick in an all senior staff call where I challenged an inclusion and diversity consultant on the use of "gender neutral" toilets, corrected it to mixed sex and asked how to reconcile with other protected characteristics (sex, religion) that needed single sex provision.

FatCatThinCat · 03/06/2021 15:51

This is what winds me up no end, that women are being cowed into silence. And I include myself in that. I have to guard myself on social media because I know I'm not tough enough to withstand the backlash if I so much as hint that I believe in biology.

Iliketherainbest · 03/06/2021 15:43

Sorry to hear you are feeling sick about this. I have worked for charities all my life. Becoming registered carries significant weight. Its not a lightweight process. It is a regulated sector. Moreover the Charity Comission appears to have been extremely diligent with LGBA because of the concerns which have been raised. And their report covers that in detail. Rather than get drawn into related issues, maybe point all this out. A legitimately registered charity should be a valid potential source of advice for any organisation.

HermioneWeasley · 03/06/2021 15:43

Perhaps they are taking you up on your offer to explain more about them.

They focus on the rights of same sex attracted people, that’s it. There are plenty of organisations which focus only on trans issues, and they don’t have to defend why they don’t include the LGB

proudwomansexmatters · 03/06/2021 15:38

Good for you @Iwasonlytryingtohelp Please come back and update us. I work in HR and the amount of EDI Material I have to update to reintroduce sex as the protected characteristic is astounding and frustrating. It really should not be that hard to be factually correct.

I hope they listen to you

highame · 03/06/2021 15:33

If you want an organisation who is excellent at the EA in workplaces look to Ann Sinnott's company AEA, they have a good reputation and are really on top of the EA. They already do this work, not sure LGBA are at this stage yet - put me right if that's incorrect.

YoBeaches · 03/06/2021 15:33

@JediGnot OP has said nothing about a complaint. She made a suggestion in a HR meeting and they are taking her up on her offer to chat offline.

Fabulous.

SpindleWhorl · 03/06/2021 15:30

Don't feel sick, mate, you can do this. If you want to keep it all low key and faux innocent - and who could blame you - just say you saw the press release from the Charity Commission and thought, 'oh, a nice new lovely charity for gay acceptance'. Keep batting it back to the Charity Commission.

(That Mermaids appeal won't go anywhere. Stonewall has already dropped out of it.)

You have Liz Truss and the EHRC on your side!

UppityPuppity · 03/06/2021 15:29

Good luck.

The LGBA are keeping to the equality act - sexual orientation = protected characteristic = same sex attracted.

That’s all you need to say.

You are within the law.

JustcameoutGC · 03/06/2021 15:28

I know that feeling. Try and quietly find some allies. Look at the chat in the Women's network / gender equality network. Look for who is not using pronouns. People with a scientific background are a good bet. Steer clear of HR and the social media team. Try and get someone else to speak up with you.

I am in the process of doing this myself...

YoBeaches · 03/06/2021 15:27

I was just going to suggest the same re charity commission - don't make it about LGB Alliance vs Stonewall - highlight the options available and share your view on why you might choose to steer away from some like stonewall due to current status.

This is 'light inflluencing'. If they chose stonewall for example then you can all Gung ho as to why, but you probably don't need to.

I do this regularly - not in my jobs remit but HR now regularly want to run things by me for my 'objective viewpoint'. Become of value and remain pragmatic.

Leafstamp · 03/06/2021 15:27

Well done for speaking up OP. I hope it goes well. There will be people on your side.

JediGnot · 03/06/2021 15:27

@Iwasonlytryingtohelp

It's a job i love. I am going to take extreme care in what I say and what I don't.
I'd be seriously tempted to ask that before the meeting you would like HR to speak to the original complainant and have them explain what is transphobic about LGB Alliance and let you know, because -

(1) You would like to be prepared if possible.
and
(2) obviously if you have been inadvertently supporting a transphobic organisation you would like to apologize to HR and those offended ASAP, as well as ceasing your support.

Iwasonlytryingtohelp · 03/06/2021 15:22

Good idea. Thanks. I feel quite sick.

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SpindleWhorl · 03/06/2021 15:21

Good luck.

You could refer HR to the Charity Commission's report on LGBA's successful application for charitable status. Covers it all, really - and the Charity Commission is government affiliated.

Iwasonlytryingtohelp · 03/06/2021 15:20

Oh and it was an all-staff call, so guess I have announced I am GC to everyone. Which may not have been a good idea.

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ShirleyPhallus · 03/06/2021 15:18

Good luck!

NoCureForLove · 03/06/2021 15:17

Oh and maybe mention the recent decoupling from Stonewall by a number of big / respected organisations ...

Iwasonlytryingtohelp · 03/06/2021 15:17

It's a job i love. I am going to take extreme care in what I say and what I don't.

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