Whose a good enough femminist.

Good ENOUGH feminist? Gumbo, you are feministing brilliantly, never for a moment imagine otherwise. Supporting women, mobilising women, informing women (the fake tan thing never would have occurred to me in terms of useful & welcome, so that's noted with thanks).

When I read your opening post, the Martha and Mary story came inescapably to mind. It's one I have always struggled with, having a strong urge to slap Mary upside the head for flinging expensive unguents around and making a mess because fascinated by what a bloke has to say, while her sister is going spare in the kitchen, etc. But we do need both.

Gumbo, I agree wholeheartedly about not re-labelling sexual exploitation as “sex work”.

I found some of the sentiments about who can run a refuge on the Posie thread quite troubling. There can certainly be hierarchies within movements, and the women’s liberation movement is no exception. I may be wrong, but it seemed to me on that thread, that there is a tendency among some feminist with expertise in the VAWG sector to see themselves as the only experts, and everyone else should butt out.

It is a little tricky, as I would not want to deny that there are experts, women who have masses and masses of expertise, built up over decades. But others, like yourself, equally have masses and masses to contribute. As the need far outweighs supply of help, surely doing what you are doing makes a vital difference, and discouraging women who want to help from getting involved is not something women, as a class, can afford.

One thing that really stood out in your posts is listening to the women you are helping, and treating them as equals. Several posts in the Posie discussion shun a light on where there is room for improvement in current DV provisions. Too many women have felt ignored and patronised by the so-called experts, and even though I claim no expertise at all, I think it would be really helpful to have a discussion about how abusive dynamics can be replicated even in the very services set up to help women out of abusive relationships. It is too important an issue to shy away from that discussion, even though it may get bloody.

Thank you for doing! 👏

Good on you. And you're right, there's no time for point scoring.

Gumbo 💐

Mumsnet has helped a lot of women leave abusive relationships. Lots of good advice, helpful and supportive women on here.

As someone has said it takes all kinds of people to push us forward the doers and the talkers.

The occasional supporters and the ones who dedicate their lives all make a difference.

I don't know if it's the case on here, but I'm convinced 90% of people who post 'awareness raising', virtue signalling type stuff do little or nothing to actually make life better for people. We need campaigns and intelligent discussion but I think actually doing the unglamorous work is more important, and can often be overlooked. Thank you for being someone who really does make a difference.

It sounds like what you are doing is really important and worthwhile with the added advantage of it being provided by local women who know each other.

Local initiatives such as this are just how Women's Aid first started (I posted a thread earlier today about the origins of Women's Aid and what is described is nearly exatly what you are doing.) www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4260463-The-movement-against-domestic-violence-celebrating-our-history And yes it was primarily local working class women who took the initiative.

And for any women who dont feel able to do what you are doing there is probably a refuge local to you that would love local support. Whether fund raising or volunteering. Refuges are now far more than a bed space for a couple of nights. They try to help women move onto a new life, this can mean giving legal advice, finding permenant housing, supporting children. And all of this at a time when funding is being cut.

I haven't followed all the Posie thread and so am not aware of what has been said. I did raise an objection to the implication that those already working for DV services weren't standing up for women only services. Because some are.

I think what you are doing is a way of offering support on a level that you can manage and now you have helped another woman. And could be used as a model for women to get together locally at a grassroots level.

Long may you continue! I am sure there are many women who remember you and your friends with warmth and appreciation.

Thank you Gumbomambo. It sounds to me like you are doing some really important work.

For the most part on FWR it is women pulling together and doing their parts large or small. I think it is so important to value every contribution. So, thank you. And I hope that you continue posting.

Well op you've already made better sense than anything I posted on the Posie Parker thread, and you do much more important work too. Please keep posting and thanks for everything

I don't have the patience for long Posie threads myself, gum. As someone who left an abusive relationship, thank you for the work that you and your colleagues are doing. It's so important.

Thank you for everything you do, Gumbo.
I donate where I can but I'm a bit hamstrung by mega nursery bills (also a feminist issue). I haven't donated to Posie yet but will read the rest of the thread; I prefer charities so they can claim gift aid!

I tried avoiding the posie thread but when someone referred to blm i felt i had to say something!

Gumbo, the work you’re doing sounds incredible. Thank you so much.

I avoid certain threads , such as anything with posie in because they do seem to descend into nasty bickering

A practical doing is worth a lot more than words on a forum

There were two women in the area I worked in that ran their own DV 'rescue' service. They had a mobile number that one or the other would answer 24/7. They'd go out and get the woman and her children and take them in then help them get refuge support. They had emergency boxes with nappies, milk, toiletries, sanpro, donated clothes and toys to give escaping women who walked out with nothing but the clothes they had on. They'd go to court with them when it got that far.

They were bloody incredible. And they didn't need academic feminist theory to inform their work.

OP please don't underestimate yourself

Any woman who rolls up her sleeves and gets stuck in in the real world has my utmost respect. This is how Women’s Aid got started in the 70s. Ordinary women doing whatever they can for other women.

All strength to you Gumbo!

I agree, OP.

Just remember this is Mumsnet, we're renowned for being able to start a fight in an empty room.

Most of the posters here care very deeply about the issues. Sometimes there are disagreements and a bit of a fight, and yes, it's a pity. But I think most people are fighting because they care, if that makes sense. They want things done the best way they can.

And the crowdfunder is doing pretty well, I think.