Whose a good enough femminist.

@Gumbomambo

You’re doing absolutely fantastic work, most likely saving lives in the process.

Do you have support now?

Posts on social media do not always communicate effectively what the poster means.

Your experiences are absolutely horrific and you were clearly let down

They try to make you stay at home don't help you leave even if you at risk of homeless or being killed or both. They do everything not to help and then you feel like more alone than ever because without partner, need support from services but they don't want to help. They act like they think you're making it up even if there's evidence and maybe because they haven't got enough time to help but they should be honest and not trick to into trying to leave if then you end up more dangerous situation and without no one to help. Sorry again just frightened because finally trusted places to help and then turns out all tricks and lies and pretence to pretend officially they help but they don't. Too scared to even ask for help now and don't see how I'll get through it. Completely left with no one fighting for me no one helping they don't care if they leave you in a more dangerous situation and no one to turn to or trust. They tell to leave but then you end up homeless so obviously you need to be back with partner but leaving makes it more dangerous. Why is it ok to encourage women like me to be homeless. We shouldn't be told to leave. Better beatings and even death than nowhere safe to live and no support. They don't care and nowhere to turn or to trust.

Sorry again. Most are wonderful kind working so hard but I experienced what it is like when it goes wrong. Destroys you as much as violence and abuse. Nothing worse than asking for help and not getting it. There's been sexual abuse but asking for help and not getting it feels sort of more violating. Humiliating and like I'm dirty bad worthless undeserving person. Sitting here today wanting a chance to start again safe but not knowing where to turn just alone with the fear and lack of safety and no one to trust.

Sorry and thank you and sorry again to post but just wanted to be clear I didn't mean middle class accent means no physical abuse and only emotional. Been nearly killed several times. Just without help when need it. Nowhere to turn and don't know who to trust. People told me they'd help with then either was a lie or change their minds and then was suddenly left with no help at all. Nowhere safe to end up long term and going to refuge made it all worse as more angry and more unsafe. Sorry don't mean to ruin this thread just feel like no way out but not posting because of me. Just feel still in your post unconscious stereotype of middle class accent less likely to be violence but not always true and if disabled complete trap no way out.

Nosafe you don’t need to apologise. And I’m sorry if my post upset you, I can see how it does next to yours. You deserved to be treated equally and with respect when you were seeking help.

All stereotypes are harmful. My friend has a Scottish accent. I don't know what background was. Her ex sat on her chest and pummelled her face.

My point was that her own situation, as an employed teacher, gave her more ability to physically escape him quickly (the trauma can be life long) than the women in the local community where there was generational unemployment and actually, generational 'acceptance'/ normalisation of DV. Not least as the school had a connection to local SS and the police and she had so much immediate support from them. It doesn’t minimise the effects and impact of the abuse though.

People like that post think middle class accent means need less help and have money or job but they don't realise about financial abuse and disability.

No I think the opposite. All women are at risk of male violence and abuse. Another close friend became a sahm to Gp husband and suffered extreme emotional and financial abuse, which is still continuing via the children and maintenance despite their divorce and her working part time in education. I have another friend who went to Oxford and then did an MA who had to escape an emotionally abusive marriage to an Oxford lecturer, she was a librarian. It was actually hard for them to even begin to talk about it as their husbands were so well respected. They fear being disbelieved. They also didn’t see it as abuse for a long time. (The first friend still resists my encouragement to contact women's aid about a particular current issue as she feels she won't be taken seriously due to her background and, indeed, accent.)

There are so many intersections that cause different risks and barriers to seeking and accessing help, such as, as you say, such as disability.

Women absolutely shouldn’t be judged nor treated differently. And I’m sorry you were and had to fight so hard.

And how my poor lovely teaching colleague was beaten black and blue by her then husband. Both were affected by male violence. my colleague had options, money and is now a head, working in the same area. Her pain is and was no less at all. But she had more structures to lean on.

Thank you so much Gum for what you do so kind and wonderful. Not you but this poster stereotype not deliberate but what I mean when say some people have idea of what victims need help or deserve it more so women like me get risk of murder because maybe middle class sounding accent but no money to leave. People like that post think middle class accent means need less help and have money or job but they don't realise about financial abuse and disability. Sorry again to post and not about Gum who such kind things just really upsetting because idea like WarrierN that some victims with middle class accent have options and means not true and most services realise but not all and sometimes experienced unconscious attitudes. Sorry not explaining properly and hard to explain without upsetting people just wish less stereotype idea of victims not just class or accent but age. Sorry again.

I posted this on the Posie thread (and elsewhere) but one of the things that happened after it became more normal (though not reliable) to get funding for refuges many women who have been supportive in a local way sort of stepped back. Not because they thought they didn't have the skills, but an assumption that funding would cover everything.

In fact the intial funding wasn't funding at all, but an agreement that women in refuges could claim housing benefit (this is why historically refuge funding always came under housing and it was only years later that the concept of funding for women specifically in response to male violence happened - partly because men didn't want it to be acknowledged that there was such a problem).

But many refuges only survive through local support. And in fact if refues hadn't been left isolated and coming under pressure from funders' priorities, we may not (perhaps) have landed up with the refuges being told single sex services weren't a priority.

If you check with you local refuge, particularly at christmas they will post a list of items they would like donated, or may have an amazon wish list.

But as with appeals for refugees (whether in camps or without settled status) and in fact what happened after Grenfell, donating old clothes etc., my seem like a generous thing to do, but can add to the sense of being dislocated from your own live wearing someone else's hand me downs. Far better to have a jumble / car boot sale and give money. Or sets of underwear or whatever.

Whether as an informal network of friends or an actual support group this seems like such a positive thing to be doing.

Just in case anyone thinks I am dismissing what OP has talked about, I am saying this is such a great example of how it is possible to support women as volunteers and as paid "professionals".

An in an ideal world would be great to do this in cooperative way.

I do like the river example. we need both sorts of people. people who can wak upstream and deal with the problem and people who are there to pull people out in the mean time.

also, gum is dealing with helping people where she is. yes, other demographics of women suffer too, someone assumed that as I had my "telephone voice" on when I rang for help that it was not me who needed help. but we still need people like gum to get on and do. other people can get on and support where they are.

I agree with the knickers....

I ran away and forgot to take pants. thankfully I ran to my mums and could borrow hers. I really was wearing granny pants then.

you are doing a great job. better to get on and do what you can to make a difference than argue about the rights and wrongs of doing something while those who need help suffer.

‘I think I might have mis represented myself when I said “talk to teaching assistants”, I didn’t mean go around sticking your nose in and asking for personal private information. I just meant we heard people talking and knew people struggling with no support and that’s how we started to help.’

Oh, that makes sense! Yes, I misunderstood earlier.

Teaching assistants often live in the immediate local community. I find they often are aware of the families who need help through community networks and friends.

You sound amazing Op. And yes I've seen some brilliant stuff done at grass roots level through local churches.

FWR is a melting pot of views and experiences; never be afraid to post your view.

What's good is that we are can discuss all this stuff. Sometimes theory overrides a bit and going back to basics is always valuable.

I have always taught in schools in deprived areas where generations of families struggle to find employment. I remember early on in my career the stark reality of a mother of a pupil sleeping in the school playground bike shelter one night. School helped her find help. And how the cheapest crack cocaine in the city could be bought from outside my y2 classroom.

And how my poor lovely teaching colleague was beaten black and blue by her then husband.

Both were affected by male violence. my colleague had options, money and is now a head, working in the same area. Her pain is and was no less at all. But she had more structures to lean on.

I'm another one who can't be bothered getting involved in a Posie thread!

I didn't read the Posie thread, but please keep posting, Gumbo. There are people from different walks of life on FWR, with different perspectives. As PP said, hearing you loud and clear.

@nosafeguardingadults

I don’t think ops saying only working class women experience violence.
Working class women are generally regarded as the wrong kind of women And can therefore experience different layers of oppression. Intersectionality 101.

I agree @Gumbomambo

I’ve found it very difficult on some threads as some posters are so dismissive and rude frankly.
My daily life is similar to yours in that I’m on the coal face every day. I’m also a survivor of ACE. I’m also a gender studies scholar and am currently doing a big research project that centres the female victims of CSE.
I’ve been accused on several threads by regular posters of being ‘against women’ and ‘not a real feminist’ and also my favourite ‘blaming women’, by people who really should know better.
It saddens me really.

Thanks for your hard work supporting women, OP.

It’s not really work. It’s just a bunch of “old fashioned” women looking after our own. When you start the amount of women around you just floats it. No one wants to see a young girl with kids getting hurt and vilified

Please don't be upset or angry for my post. Think what you do so lovely and kind and posting for other people to understand not against you. Just hope people understand why harder sometimes for women not typical idea of domestic violence victim or seen as less important like older and no children hard to get help and one reason why older women get murdered. Don't mean upset you and what you doing so amazing and most important is helping the children but just want people to understand why people maybe not fitting in don't leave. You help your own so people not part of your own not easy to get right help. Not as important if no children but just want people to understand why some women don't leave. sorry again for post because you doing really nice kind thing and not your fault about situation of other women because you can't help everyone not your job and problem is the councils.

That’s a very negative view of other women you have there.

The nasty derisive ‘clever women’ really set my teeth on edge. It’s very very common for misogynists to belittle intelligent or educated women (the two are not necessarily the same). I wouldn’t choose to speak that way of other women myself.

‘If you can talk to any teaching assistant in your local school they will tell you where to start. That’s where we started. A prostitute who had her children in danger.’

Random people asking classroom assistants to tell them which mothers and children in the school are vulnerable is a safeguarding nightmare and the assistant could be sacked.

Please report anyone you see doing this to the school and the police. It could well be grooming.

I don’t have any issue with Posie or someone else setting up a refuge. I am sure it can be done. But that doesn’t mean we have to approve of anything that is supposedly ‘help’ just because we personally side with either professionals or non professionals.

clean pair of knickers

Sorry to post the other post just upsetting because have experienced less support or feeling like they didn't want to help because middle class accent but definitely not all of them and many really good kind women helping and thank you to remember knickers. I went a week without any in refuge as didn't get chance to take much.

We are all working class women.

Don't understand why only working class because not only working class women are abused and includes financial abuse. sorry don't want to upset you just upsetting because attitudes that only working class women victims of domestic violence means harder for other women to get help.

Hearing loud and clear