Page 2 | Have to fill out an equalities form as ‘cis woman’ and not happy!

Rejoiningperson · 2021-05-20T14:13:37+00:00

I’ve just applied for a temporary job that I really want. However I am pretty cross that at the end of the form, the Equalities Monitoring Form has only one box I can tick, and I don’t agree with any of them. I’m pretty cross as their form means that they really have no idea whether women are being represented in their organisation or not. It says: Are you: Male (including both cis men and trans men) Women (including both cis women and trans women) Non Binary Other I’m a bit big on the accuracy of data, as this used to be part of my job. This equalities form breaks equality law doesn’t it? There might as well not be a question here. For example at the end of the year they could say that 80% of their organisation are women - but they could actually be men identifying as women. Crazy! I want to leave the question blank. I do not identify as a cis woman. Or a trans woman. And circling it means nothing at all. As a woman I’m invisible.

OhLordyWhatNow · 20/05/2021 21:10

Feeling your pain, I answered a diversity monitoring questionnaire recently.

What is your gender?
man
women
prefer to self-describe
prefer not to say

I chose prefer to self-describe and wrote in the text box I do not have a gender, my sex is female.

NiceGerbil · 20/05/2021 21:09

In all honesty if it was a job application. Even though these things are supposed to be kept confidential. I'd probably tick woman.

It's up to you obv.

The not working there thing- this is everywhere and often has no relation to what the company is actually about iyswim. The hr dept don't look into things in detail they just use what seems to be the current norm. Most are not all over the current situation and it's not a statement of intent or anything.

Leafstamp · 20/05/2021 21:08

camdennewjournal.com/article/new-year-honours-obe-awarded-campaigning-mother-cyclist-killed-lorry?sp=21&sq=hampstead%2520school%2520of%2520art

Leafstamp · 20/05/2021 21:08

@Thevoiceofreason2021

Tick women and get the job. I watched a documentary on some poor women who’s daughter was killed by a lorry whilst out cycling. After much campaigning and no progress, she bought shares in the lorry company, attended the AGM and took the stage. They had to hear her out, As a shareholder, and subsequently bought about the changes she wanted. Many women share your frustration, but you can’t force change from outside, you need to be imbedded within the organisation to challenge such women nonsense

This is an amazing story. I just googled, and she got an OBE!

I shall file away this approach (buying shares in a company in order to attend the AGM) for the future!

Mum2jenny · 20/05/2021 20:57

I’d go for ‘other’ as the options do not represent your reality

MarshaBradyo · 20/05/2021 20:57

Haha love the venn diagram

MrsTerryPratchett · 20/05/2021 20:56

@JellySlice I laughed out loud at that. Regardless of anything else I respect both Venn diagrams generally and posters who post diagrams.

MN at it's finest.

Barracker · 20/05/2021 20:54

It's perfectly clear.

Just like this:
Have you stopped kicking puppies for sport
A. Yes
B. No

McDuffy · 20/05/2021 20:22

Great post @Artichokeleaves
I work in a stonewall champion organisation and my best pal at work is covertly GC as he thinks that's the best way to effect change. He's a shrewd political operator and asks lots of "innocent" questions, whereas I've had my card marked as a possible transphobe for being much more vocal. People will listen to his moderate voice more, but are suspicious of my agenda (of safeguarding women's rights )
Anyway, long way of saying that I try to rein it in a bit because I'm better inside the tent pissing out (do we have an analogy that works for female biology?!)

gottakeeponmovin · 20/05/2021 20:12

I wouldn't want to work there

WeeSisters · 20/05/2021 20:03

Tick ‘other’. It’s useless to them as data, but if enough people do it, then they will start having to make changes as data on mysterious non-gendered beings is useless. Eventually, they will realise that they need one question on sex and one on gender identity.

MarshaBradyo · 20/05/2021 19:13

@Thevoiceofreason2021

Tick women and get the job. I watched a documentary on some poor women who’s daughter was killed by a lorry whilst out cycling. After much campaigning and no progress, she bought shares in the lorry company, attended the AGM and took the stage. They had to hear her out, As a shareholder, and subsequently bought about the changes she wanted. Many women share your frustration, but you can’t force change from outside, you need to be imbedded within the organisation to challenge such women nonsense

Incredible woman and you’re right we should get the jobs and try to change it.

megletthesecond · 20/05/2021 19:13

I'd tick other.
I've already done it and added "woman" next to it or in the further details box if there is one.

BaggoMcoys · 20/05/2021 19:06

@Thevoiceofreason2021

Tick women and get the job. I watched a documentary on some poor women who’s daughter was killed by a lorry whilst out cycling. After much campaigning and no progress, she bought shares in the lorry company, attended the AGM and took the stage. They had to hear her out, As a shareholder, and subsequently bought about the changes she wanted. Many women share your frustration, but you can’t force change from outside, you need to be imbedded within the organisation to challenge such women nonsense

Wow, she sounds like quite a woman. Horrible circumstances but I admire her tenacity.

JoodyBlue · 20/05/2021 18:46

Sex has disappeared due to advice given by advisory groups like Stonewall to companies stating that sex is unimportant in collecting data. Did you see any of the hoo hah around the census questions this year? Fairplay for Women managed to get a turnaround to require accurate sex data question inclusion, within days only of the census date.

Artichokeleaves · 20/05/2021 18:39

I hear you. It's enforcing that women must be labelled as 'cis', which is a political statement confirming a specific political viewpoint. It's like having a box saying 'Religion' with options 'Sikh' 'Islam' and 'Christian' to choose from, with no mention of any other faiths or an option of atheist.

No. Either we respect all people's personal identities and chosen words equally, or it's not coming from genuinely inclusive values but a furthering of a specific political agenda involving forced participation in a belief.

Other, or blank.

Thevoiceofreason2021 · 20/05/2021 18:32

Tick women and get the job. I watched a documentary on some poor women who’s daughter was killed by a lorry whilst out cycling. After much campaigning and no progress, she bought shares in the lorry company, attended the AGM and took the stage. They had to hear her out, As a shareholder, and subsequently bought about the changes she wanted. Many women share your frustration, but you can’t force change from outside, you need to be imbedded within the organisation to challenge such women nonsense

midgedude · 20/05/2021 18:22

It has changed because people "think" it's inclusive

Your only option is to put other which if enough people do it will highlight the stupidity of it all

All transwomen identify as women and women as other should work

Cleanandpress · 20/05/2021 18:14

It's entirely optional so don't complete any of it.

Original poster

Rejoiningperson · 20/05/2021 17:09

There are no questions on sex - only on gender. Why is gender more important in equalities that’s sex? Why has sex disappeared? Don’t understand and have not read the evidence to back up this change.

OP posts:

ChiefClerkDrumknott · 20/05/2021 17:03

But I agree witb others, there should be an option for Sex and a seperate, optional gender identity box

ChiefClerkDrumknott · 20/05/2021 17:03

Anything that asks for my ‘Gender’ I tick Other

MarshaBradyo · 20/05/2021 16:57

I don’t want to click other

I want female

MarshaBradyo · 20/05/2021 16:57

I hear you

I had this recently very irritating

Original poster

Rejoiningperson · 20/05/2021 16:53

I think @JellySlice Venn diagram is the most accurate in terms of data - including the clown fish!

Thanks all. Makes me feel a little less crazy. Spent so many years accurately recording data in order to reduce and address inequalities.

I will tick Other or just leave blank. It’s attached to the application form (last page) which I was taught was a big No No as it takes away the anonymity if it’s stored and printed with the person’s name and details.

OP posts: