Girl pushed under train.

In Malahide, an innocent boy aged about 15 was chased by this gang. In terror he jumped onto a car at traffic and this gang were lashing at him with chains. Eventually they forced him off the car and beat him badly and he was taken to hospital. There was a poor family in the car with children.

This is just disgusting and heartbreaking

I’m confused by this:

Its shocking, but attacks like this specific one are not common

Yet also

frequently out causing trouble and this has got massively worse under lockdown

And

often hang out in their own areas and are generally intimidating

So attacks like this, male on female violence, are rare? Im sorry to say they really aren’t

Too right 'women are screaming for punishment' as you phrase it. Billions to your softly softly approach. There is no excuse for this behaviour what so ever.
Id like to see them all made an example of. Posters with the tag line 'You chose to behave like this, then it will be the last choice you ever make.'

No @mainsfed; I am not a man. And probably I still have some misogynistic traits on me that I need working on. A lifetime of becoming self-aware about sexism and others forms of discrimination have told me we are all part of the problem.

The 'women screaming' is probably not the best way of expressing my point. On this occasion though, the main point I wanted to make
stands

Zero tolerance is the answer. I have worked in education and absolutely agree with this.
I hope all those young males there will be punished. Spending the rest of their days incarcerated and make examples of would be the ideal outcome.

Lots of reports say they were the same gang @Redandpink

I don’t know whether that’s been confirmed though.

Absolute scum, if they were my sons I would be disgusted with them. This intimidating, horrific behaviour should be punished.

I agree with @namechangemarch21 that there are other problems behind this and one of them is lack of integration in society. But just looking at this thread, women also scream for 'punishment' instead of rehabilitation when these things happen.

Patriarchal violence cannot be addressed (in my view) with more patriarchal violence

It has nothing to do with affluence.

Boys from all areas and backgrounds have shown violence and not just since Covid.

The girl who was stabbed in the neck at Dun Laoghaire pier a couple of years ago and nearly died? Local boy from a very “naice” background did that. Just an example.

This was on Reddit ireland.

www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/n33jau/off_the_dart_no_guards_terrorising_a_family_i_got/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

It's a gang of youths attacking a car stopped at traffic. There was a family in that car. I don't know if they were pulled out or they left their own car.

It's gangs and thugs are way out of hand. A sizable portion of the population are good, decent people and no body deserves this while they go about their days going to and from work and school and other activities.

There are gangs of youths so nothing will be done about them.

Fucking scum. I hope they end up as losers in life.

But violence continues to be perpetrated mainly by men. Agree with this. I do hope that this horrible video gets some real change going though - but making it a men against female issue (rather than a male violence & cultural issue) won’t get to the heart of it to stop more in the future. There must be ways other countries have tackled this with say, zero tolerance or some other way?

I heard a really good police commissioner on the radio recently who turned Glasgow from one of the highest knife and murder areas in the Europe around by tackling it absolutely everywhere. He was really inspiring to listen to. We need him to go to Dublin!

I thought it was Howth Junction and not Howth? Howth Junction is a deprived area. Howth is more affluent. I think, maybe someone more local to Dublin can correct me.

[quote FloconDeNeige]@MrsTroutfireVII

These are not working class boys. I’m from a working class family; am now an expat scientist in Switzerland. Many of my friends from working class families are perfectly respectable members of society; doctors, teachers, police, civil servants etc.

Sick of this narrative that working class (boys in particular) are feral scum. These boys here aren’t working class; they’re from a strata on the fringes of society, probably from non-working, broken families with criminality thrown in.[/quote]
I also despair at how many stereotypes so damaging for women and equality, are thrown about in a feminist chat. 'not all Dubliners' is another one here.

This is clearly about male violence. Other men (mostly those perceived as more vulnerable) could have been victims too. But violence continues to be perpetrated mainly by men. This tells us there is an important problem to address on how men grow up & socialise/etc. You don't address this with some bullshit about class and nationality

Horrific video. I hope the publicity for this makes it totally impossible for any club to employ this idiot.

They are just as likely to be local kids or they’ve come on the DART from another “seaside township”

There was a big street brawl in Dalkey the other day, loads of 14/ 15 year olds out of their minds on drink. Plenty of Dalkey kids among them.

This isn’t a class issue.

To give a bit of local context:

• this was the number one item on the national news when it happened. I hadn't heard about the connection with the football club, presumably because there are prohibitions on naming minors in the media, but it is a big deal, and isn't commonplace. I am a bit bemused by people saying they'd avoid Dublin as a weekend break - this is really not something you're likely to come across. Its shocking, but attacks like this specific one are not common. People saying the girls must be used to it: they're facing a gang of boys and keeping their heads down and their faces neutral. On the rare times I've been in situations like this, not in Ireland, that is what I have done. I have not doubt they've walked past gangs of teenage boys hanging around looking intimidating, but escalating like this is shocking. It doesn't excuse it, but it hopefully will prompt a change in response.

• the issue is that there are small groups of mid-teen boys in deprived areas of Dublin who are frequently out causing trouble and this has got massively worse under lockdown. Children who were barely in education have left altogether. Schools only returned in Dublin in ... March? for this age group. We've been under total lockdown, since Christmas, till a few weeks ago.

• They don't just target women, but obviously women are particularly vulnerable. There was a case in East Wall, a deprived area that is just adjacent to the financial services centre, where deliveroo drivers refused to deliver there after one was attacked, a teenager ended up stabbed to death by a deliveroo driver who claimed to be carrying a knife for protection. A woman returning from her cleaning job was stabbed by a passing 15 year old on a bike and died. There was a lot of shock, and calls for an immediate response: the reality is, these areas would normally be busy, and teeming with people - its the city centre. But now, almost nobody is working there and the police presence has been inadequate.

• There is a huge class dimension. They often hang out in their own areas and are generally intimidating to people there and I think that factors into it not being a huge police focus. Which to be honest is somewhat similar to my experience when I lived n some of the less salubrious parts of London. They often target (usually male) cyclists who come through their areas by throwing missiles, or runners. Again, where I'm thinking of, they are in deprived areas surrounded by 'gentrifying' ones. They are often arrested, and charged, and given suspended sentences or else placed in youth detention. But on the whole they are mid-teens. They're too young for 'serious' consequences and don't seem particularly intimidated by the consequences that are there.

• On sunny days, teenagers from all over the city head to the coast. The DART train service runs along the coast. There has been recurring, sporadic, issues with teenagers taking over carriages and being intimidating for years - there's little that can be done if 30 15 year olds carrying cans and a sound system rock up. The train guards are not equipped to deal with them. About once a summer there's a report of them being intimidating/robbing someone, and calls for a better response, but usually its a seasonal thing and gets little attention.

• Train staff have wanted a proper police response to this for years. Its obviously worsening now: we've had the only decent weather this year in recent weeks and there's nowhere for anyone to go. Police have been redeployed to covid duties. The hope is that there is a proper response this time.

But while this absolutely is a problem of male violence, it is also a problem of systematic, inter-generational deprivation, and a poorly integrated justice system. Nobody is seriously looking at how and why rehabilitation is failing, or how to protect people from these children without demonising them. I agree the contempt you see these boys show towards the girls is shocking, but they feel that contempt towards basically everyone. I think that's the destination another poster was making. They have been failed wholesale, and society as a whole will pay the price, but addressing it isn't as simple as changing attitudes to women: its figuring out how they have been so ostracised and alienated from society in general to think this behaviour is acceptable.

I've emailed the club directly asking what steps they are taking to be part of the solution and not the problem

[email protected]

PLEASE DON'T POST THE PETITION LINK

MNHQ move threads to the petition board when this happens. It would be good to keep the thread in FWR.