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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Laurel Hubbard to go to Tokyo

513 replies

Biscuitsanddoombar · 05/05/2021 20:59

Not a surprise and hopefully it’ll open some eyes about the utter ridiculousness of allowing someone who is male to compete against women in weightlifting

www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/may/05/trans-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard-set-to-make-history-at-tokyo-olympics

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26
mollythemeerkat · 22/06/2021 09:51

@BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz

If a biological female athlete had a testosterone level of near 10 she would be banned for doping.
Hadnt thought of that - good point @BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz
Sophoclesthefox · 22/06/2021 09:49

@WotgunShedding

sophocles no circle to be squared - it’s already “fair and square”.
“Fair and square”?!

Absolutely shameless and dishonest Angry “sometimes a very mediocre athlete with a male body gets beaten by an extremely talented, exceptional elite woman who has trained her arse off, therefore, there is no issue with male bodies in women’s sports”.

This shows a fundamental lack of understanding of why we have women’s sports, which is that we want athletes to compete together, displaying their prowess (natural and enhanced by training) in the specific discipline that they compete in. Winning at sport is a product of selection for the factors that make a difference in each sport, and the absolute first selection cut that happens, in order for women’s sport to exist, is that we exclude males. That includes unhappy males in weakened bodies.

I think the athletes should absolutely stage a protest. I want them to go full Tommie Smith & John Carlos at the ‘68 Olympics (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Olympics_Black_Power_salute).

WotgunShedding · 22/06/2021 09:34

Hasn't India always said transwomen shouldn't participate in women's sports? There are a few topics that India has been denounced for by some of the trans community for having a different opinion and I'm sure this is one of them. I don't think this is a shift in opinion.

teawamutu · 22/06/2021 09:24

@WotgunShedding

It was India Willoughby discussing it on GMB, not India Knight!
Ah, now that's even more interesting. IW realising there's been a massive overreach, perhaps?
endofthelinefinally · 22/06/2021 09:02

"Post surgery"?
LH hasn't had surgery. That is quite obvious in the photographs.

WotgunShedding · 22/06/2021 08:54

It was India Willoughby discussing it on GMB, not India Knight!

BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 22/06/2021 08:51

I would a public stand from the women on this event. If non participation is not an option, and it were me, I'd do this -

Biological women who win silver and bronze step down off the platform and stand in front of the respective gold/silver/bronze spots.

Silver hand her medal to bronze and stand medal less confront of the gold podium. Bronze hand her medal to whoever came 4th and then stand in front of the silver podium.

BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 22/06/2021 08:49

If a biological female athlete had a testosterone level of near 10 she would be banned for doping.

Taikoo · 22/06/2021 08:46

Very unfair.

IrmaFayLear · 22/06/2021 08:46

I can’t believe that to qualify for women’s sport an athlete can retain their male genitalia. So they could in fact, minus the hormones, revert to being a male if they so chose.

I think the person in the street thinks that a trans person has undergone a sex change - ie they have passed the point of no return which includes the lopping off of external indicators. A “female” competitor with full male tackle? That is just insanity.

NecessaryScene · 22/06/2021 08:42

Posie's going to be quite busy on Sunday. Doing all that walking and banner-waving single-handed. Flowers

Ekofisk · 22/06/2021 08:41

I've always doubted sport would be the issue over prisons or medicating children - but on reflection, it's more clear cut, isn't it?

It’s clearly unfair, it’s highly visible, it’s an affront to the sporting ethos of fair play, and it’ll bring the sunlight to the millions of people that have been unaware of what has been going on over the last few years.

Helleofabore · 22/06/2021 08:37

The fact that they asked Harper about whether they were comfortable with the OIC policy....

OF COURSE Harper is 'comfortable' with it. It was Harper and that rather dodgy study of them and their friend's running times that was instrumental in the decision. Harper was on the panel!!!

corkernewyorker · 22/06/2021 08:36

Now Andrew Doyle. It's rather confusing hearing people talking sense about this openly without censorship or tieing themselves in knots to be pc.

NotBadConsidering · 22/06/2021 08:28

It’s ridiculous that Ross Tucker even needs to write that article, although he articulates it well. We should be discussing why everyone is pretending there isn’t an advantage, making people do the leg work to state the bleeding obvious, then still pretending it doesn’t matter even when they’ve been shown the truth by people like Tucker.

The story is the complicity of those who are wilfully ignoring this at the expense of women and girls, not any debate on the advantage.

corkernewyorker · 22/06/2021 08:25

v Joanna Harper (transwoman) and advisor to Olympic committee.

corkernewyorker · 22/06/2021 08:25

GB News now Nicola Williams from FPFW

OhHolyJesus · 22/06/2021 08:22

Posie was talking about Hubbard and her plans for Sunday last night

WoolOfBat · 22/06/2021 08:20

This has really brought it out more hasn’t it? Transwomen on lesbian dating apps can still fall under the radar for heterosexual men (and many heterosexual women). Many people are not on Twitter or miss any online abuse.

However, a non-passing transwoman in the Olympics will reach a completely new group of people who never thought about this before; the sports interested heterosexual man!

Rummikub · 22/06/2021 08:17

@mum2jakie

Being discussed on Good Morning Britain. Shame that the panel members only include transwomen, debating an issue that affects women in sport.
Perhaps that was a good thing. Hate suggesting women don’t have a voice but maybe it’s better as no one can say India knight doesn’t understand.
teawamutu · 22/06/2021 08:17

Miranda usually talks sense, so that's not a surprise at all.

The TRA contingent - I do wonder if they'll realise what a 'careful what you wish for' moment this could be.

I've always doubted sport would be the issue over prisons or medicating children - but on reflection, it's more clear cut, isn't it?

There's no safety issue, no 'but the children will commit suicide'. It's just a male-bodied person deciding that they want to compete in a voluntary activity for female-bodied people.

TheWeeDonkey · 22/06/2021 08:07

India just said make a trans Olympics. Finally some sense.

NecessaryScene · 22/06/2021 08:07

Here's Miranda's GBNews interview about Hubbard:

TheWeeDonkey · 22/06/2021 08:06

The lies, the lies! 😡

OvaHere · 22/06/2021 08:05

@2Rebecca

Excellent article. I do think the effect of trans athletes in women's sports is going to be seen to be so obviously unfair if they persist in allowing it that the situation will be reversed. It's how many female athletes are screwed over by the system until they do that that is the question.
A lot is my guess.