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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Open letter to The Bookseller says 'transphobia acceptable in British book industry'

62 replies

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 04/05/2021 13:49

t.co/eqdwe7Cqu1?amp=1

'signed anonymously from a number of trade figures, including publishers, writers, illustrators and booksellers' - no editors, though, judging by the rambling, over-long text. It seems to be in part a response to the evidence given to Parliament last week by the CEO of Hachette, who are JKR's publishers, about cancel culture. JKR not namechecked but I bet they had her in mind.

Some fairly robust responses on Twitter, I see.

OP posts:
InspiralCoalescenceRingdown · 04/05/2021 18:44

If you re-read many of the speeches and comments from the those who seek to tell us that speaking about transgender people this way is a valid opinion, and in your mind replace the word transgender with 'Jews' or 'Refugees' or 'Gay Men', you'll see how unpleasantly familiar it becomes

OK. Let's do this.

"Gentiles aren't Jews, tho."
"Refugee groups shouldn't be given privileged access to the ONS over and above other stakeholders"
"Gay men should compete in the sports category according to their sex."

thepuredrop · 04/05/2021 18:42

@Justhadathought

No Blacks, No Irish’ or drinking fountains labelled ‘Whites Only

Women's single sex spaces are being compared to acts of bigotry and prejudice,

Exactly. When toilets segregated with signs saying men and women evoke analogies with The Holocaust, your argument is morally and logically redundant.
HandsOffMyRights · 04/05/2021 18:34

SmallPug I didn't know that, so this explains the Tweet from the account, thanks.

SmallPug · 04/05/2021 18:34

There's no evidence. The only thing they have is that some people don't agree and there are some books being published by gender critical authors - hurrah. It is depressing working in the industry and seeing how much support this stuff gets all the time. It seems captured. However, this time, it doesn't seem to have had much, so perhaps they're tiring of it? I'm told there are other gender critical people in the industry but apart from a few I know, I don't know who the rest are. I constantly hope that we'll hear the end of it in publishing but so many are so captured and believe the lies. Some of the absolute guff that's trotted out would be hilarious if it wasn't so dangerous.

MrsAudreyShapiro · 04/05/2021 18:28

They haven't given examples of trans people being discriminated against or treated badly. They have not said anything specific about what they want publishers to do. It's just a load of badly written narcissistic waffle.

SmallPug · 04/05/2021 18:28

@HandsOffMyRights

On Twitter, her account writes 'Shirley supports this open letter to The Bookseller, and sends her kindest wishes to her trans and non-binary colleagues in all roles in publishing, as well as readers and their families.' with a link to the letter.
It's because her daughter is Clara Vulliamy, who is one of the most - I'll put it nicely - dedicated TRAs in the book world. I think there is a trans relative. Shirley didn't write that tweet. I think she probably just thinks it's the right thing to do and goes along with Clara's propaganda.
TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 04/05/2021 18:24

The only reply I can see on the Bookseller’s tweet puts it beautifully:

‘ Replying to
@thebookseller
If you can fathom exactly who is accused of what out of this let me know. I don't know where to begin with that letter, it is so muddle headed’

rabbitwoman · 04/05/2021 18:15

Exactly what do they want, what are they asking for?

Seems to be an effort to get jk Rowling dropped from all publishing, ever. Only then can they feel safe.....

Who else are they talking about?

I really do not understand what the point of that letter is.....

Floisme · 04/05/2021 18:01

Did someone say that's the edited version? Shock

HandsOffMyRights · 04/05/2021 17:53

On Twitter, her account writes 'Shirley supports this open letter to The Bookseller, and sends her kindest wishes to her trans and non-binary colleagues in all roles in publishing, as well as readers and their families.' with a link to the letter.

HandsOffMyRights · 04/05/2021 17:51

I was disappointed to see that Shirley Hughes is involved.

WindyPudding · 04/05/2021 17:48

have been through more uncertainties and self-exploration than most cis men and women can imagine

How on Earth do you know??? Hmm

WindyPudding · 04/05/2021 17:46

We need to start to understand and talk about gender as a spectrum, a whole colour wheel, rather than just pink and blue

Uh, yes, we've known that for centuries. Gender is such a large and complex and ever-changing spectrum that we all have our own gender expression and feminists and GNC people have always worked to make that expression more free and less shackled by "pink and blue" type concepts. It is sex that is not a spectrum. Gender-express away, no one's stopping you.

The hardest thing to say here is that the deepest damage is being done unwittingly, by those who don't understand

It must actually be hard to be deep inside genderism ideology and experience it being damaged, albeit by logic, reason, the law, and safeguarding efforts. Yes it is being damaged because it makes no sense, is causing physical and mental harm and regressive stereotyping, destroying freedoms and protections, and needs to be dismantled.

That is not the same thing as "damaging" an individual. It isn't harming someone to not agree with them and point out that they are making no sense.

I an SO GLAD the Hachette CEO is taking the stand he is. The book world is absolutely full of trans ideologues and nasty bullying disguised as lovely caring sharing inclusivity.

StandUpStraight · 04/05/2021 17:40

How absolutely ridiculous. The usual non-arguments in the usual turgid prose. It just makes them look silly.

But can I just thank nauticant for bringing that video into my life? Brilliant.

JulesJules · 04/05/2021 16:54

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 04/05/2021 15:58

Well, Hachette was oppressive last year when they told some of their junior staff they had to work on The Ickabog and if they didn't want to the door was >>>>>>>>>>>>>. That must have come as a nasty shock to some.

www.thebookseller.com/news/hachette-moves-to-back-Rowling-after-staff-concerns-1206777

How it's reached a point where staff early in their careers feel they can say they don't want to do any work for their employer's biggest client is beyond me.

OP posts:
Melroses · 04/05/2021 15:58

Well, anonymity is for the oppressed. No one else should need, or indeed be allowed, anonymity. Or something.

lookingatwoodseeingtrees · 04/05/2021 15:50

Hang on a minute. I thought all the TRas were up in arms about the letter from the Women's Writing Club to the Women's Prize being signed by anonymous and pseudonyms. But this one is fine? What a bunch of hypocrites.

NoSquirrels · 04/05/2021 15:09

An anonymous open letter is just... not a thing?

Actually, the more I think about it the more I love it. The Bookseller “edited it” - so it was even longer, good lord! - and it’s been written by a group of anonymous writers etc. They all just couldn’t bear to disappoint or disagree with each other (‘be nice’) in order to get a coherent argument or through-line structured together. I’d have loved to see the shared Google doc.

allmywhat · 04/05/2021 14:58

I really don’t understand why they made it anonymous, though. That’s weird.

For DARVO purposes, I’m assuming. So they can pretend to believe their careers are at risk or maybe someone will threaten their families for this letter full of TRA boilerplate. It’s a bit of victimhood posturing.

NoSquirrels · 04/05/2021 14:50

signed anonymously from a number of trade figures, including publishers, writers, illustrators and booksellers' - no editors, though, judging by the rambling, over-long text.
Grin

It’s a shit letter. I reckon I could have a good stab at naming some of the people involved. You can just look at the quote tweets on Twitter and draw your own conclusions.

I really don’t understand why they made it anonymous, though. That’s weird. It’s not like falling over yourself to say “publishing is not diverse or inclusive to trans people” is a controversial or minority opinion at the moment!

The worst thing about it is its ‘be nice’ message and all the annoying false equivalence drawn - and the “those of us familiar with history” patronising tone.

allmywhat · 04/05/2021 14:47

have been through more uncertainties and self-exploration than most cis men and women can imagine

Ye gods, the narcissism. How do “cis” people put up with this 💩 ?

Justhadathought · 04/05/2021 14:37

We need to start to understand and talk about gender as a spectrum, a whole colour wheel, rather than just pink and blue

Oh, for goodness sake!

Who on earth is talking about 'pink and blue'?

Justhadathought · 04/05/2021 14:35

No Blacks, No Irish’ or drinking fountains labelled ‘Whites Only

Women's single sex spaces are being compared to acts of bigotry and prejudice,

ArabellaScott · 04/05/2021 14:34

This is an edited version of the letter passed to The Bookseller:

Good God! There's writing on both sides of that paper!