Gender affirmation ruins mental health, leads to the pain of transition regret which haunts people

Every single one of us, 15 years later either has children, or is desperately trying. Every single one.

Imagine if, when we were moaning about contraception being such a pain in the arse and being sterilised would be so much easier as we definitely did not want children, imagine if the NHS agreed with is and said "yes, you're 19, you're a grown woman and you know your own mind. Yes, you can be sterilised instead".

So, has Quincy Bell officially changed back to being called Keira for lega purposes yet?
Is this not a Terrible Awful Example of deadnaming, something only Terrible Awful T*RFs do? Is this not the point where our monitors report such a Terrible Awful post to MNHQ and call for it to be deleted and the poster banned? No?

Oh well.

Why was she suspended? Surely de-transitioners should be allowed to tell their story.

Is she suspended for good or just a naughty step (mustn’t have naughty women speaking against eh?)

I don’t think there is any legal route for Keira to reverse her GRC? I think that’s one of the problems.
In the UK she can be known as Keira again, there is no need for legal processes like deed polls unless she wishes.
Best wishes to Keira and Watson, and thank you for what you have done for my daughter and girls like her.

anyway. blimey, that David Bell interview

highly recommended reading

So, has Quincy Bell officially changed back to being called Keira for lega [sic] purposes yet?

eh? is that supposed to be some kind of gotcha?

Keira Bell was a 16 year old child when she was referred to the Tavistock.

So, has Quincy Bell officially changed back to being called Keira for lega purposes yet?

Also, do you really not see the dangers of wanting to base medical decision making on the possibility a grown woman might not know her own mind? Really? You don't? You have heard of Paul Conrathe and Ana-Maria Tudor, yes?

I wish the desister stories didn't reinforce the stereotypes. I'd much rather read about a girl who still has short hair, will only wear jeans and is now working on a building site but has accepted her sex is female and is happy for others to use the pronouns 'she' or 'her'

I agree, Thingybob, though it’s good to hear of anyone who has found happiness and self-acceptance. I’m hoping examples like Keira’s and Watson’s will help more young people find the confidence to reassert their genuine selves. Then we’ll hear a wider range of experiences.

I would have thought that it's apparent to everyone that if you're someone who is drawn into an ideology that renders you completely dependent on the people around you using counter intuitive pronouns and validating your new name and new "gender", and people in your online peer group encourage you to threaten suicide to get what you want, then you go to a GIDS clinic who usher you through like you're on a trans assembly line, that you're going to suffer a decline in mental health.

This.

Bullying appears to be interwoven at every level of the establishments, in the social contagion of the peer groups of the children, in the advancement of the ideology... Prolific, constant, aggressive.

As with any other invasive and potentially irreversible treatment, all options and explanations need to be explored prior to embarking on the best possible course of treatment. There can’t be a pre-determined pathway that explicitly ignores and denies other possible diagnoses/factors.

Instant, constant and all consuming affirmation and fast-tracking to pharmacological and surgical interventions are not mandated for any other issue that children present with.

I'd much rather read about a girl who still has short hair, will only wear jeans and is now working on a building site but has excepted her sex is female and is happy for others to use the pronouns 'she' or 'her'

Thanks Fern (our user names complement each other nicely grin)

😁

I would have thought that it's apparent to everyone that if you're someone who is drawn into an ideology that renders you completely dependent on the people around you using counter intuitive pronouns and validating your new name and new "gender", and people in your online peer group encourage you to threaten suicide to get what you want, then you go to a GIDS clinic who usher you through like you're on a trans assembly line, that you're going to suffer a decline in mental health.

very many vulnerable children have been very poorly treated and will be left with, potentially, a lifetime of damage

Let's hope all these people are completely mistaken. I actually really hope that you are right, Shizuku, and that this has all been blown out of all proportion. All the children treated have had the best possible care and are happier than they would have been otherwise.

he continues to be anxious about co-morbidities such as anorexia, autism and history of trauma in its patients. “Some of the children are depressed. It’s said that it’s their gender that is the cause of this, but how do we know? And why don’t we try to treat that first?”

I am just speechless at this.

@FindTheTruth just how sad the whole thing is. The irreversible changes to Watson's body that she will have to deal with for the rest of her life are huge. But she has a great attitude and seems very pragmatic and grounded. I really hope that young women and girls will listen to people like Watson before they make any irreversible changes of their own.

Thanks Fern (our user names complement each other nicely )

I’m just posting a few sentences from that BBC news article here:

Staff at England's only children's NHS gender clinic say concerns about patient welfare were shut down, leaked documents reveal.

Clinicians reported worries that some patients were referred onto a gender transitioning pathway too quickly.

The review was published in Spring 2019 after the Trust asked its medical director, Dr Dinesh Sinha, to investigate serious concerns about children's welfare raised by staff in an internal report.

...clinicians claim child protection and safeguarding concerns were "shut down".

In the transcripts, staff are damning in their assessment of some parts of the service
"Let's pray that I am wrong because if I am not wrong, very many vulnerable children have been very poorly treated and will be left with, potentially, a lifetime of damage here," one says.

"The reality is, by not doing anything, children are potentially still being medically mismanaged."

This is really very worrying stuff.

Here is the article again, interviewing David Bell, for anyone who missed it.

www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/02/tavistock-trust-whistleblower-david-bell-transgender-children-gids

Leaf

Bell working for the Tavistock, which is the adult part, and not GIDs, which is the children's part, is in the article.

As is the fact that 10 clinicians came to him with their concerns.

Sonia Appleby is the child safeguarding lead at the Tavi. She was concerned about the lack of safeguarding, as she understood that clinicians were being advised to bypass her in certain circumstances.

This is what she says on her crowdfunding page. Easily googleable

"My Claim

I lodged a whistle-blowing claim in November 2019 at the Central London Employment Tribunal. Since then I have made 2 applications to amend my claim as new information came to light.

In my claim, I allege that because I made "protected disclosures" to my line manager regarding concerns raised by GIDS staff ( that the health or safety of patients was being, had been or was likely to be endangered), I was subjected to detriments.

I allege these detriments are:

i) the Tavistock misused it's own procedures to besmirch me and therefore jeopardize the role of safeguarding within the Trust;

ii) there was an unwritten but mandated directive from the Tavistock management that safeguarding concerns should not be brought to my attention despite being the Trust Safeguarding Children Lead;

iii) and, clinicians were discouraged from reporting safeguarding concerns to me.

I also allege various other detriments.

Further to disclosures made to Newsnight by former staff, BBC Newsnight produced a programme focusing on the allegation that the Trust did not want to report any concerns to me. www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51806962

and you can watch it here"

Which seems to tally with the experience of David Bell. Who received hostile and threatening letters, accusations of bullying, and refusal to respond to his questions, along with interfering with his emails.

If you get chance, would you mind clarifying/fleshing this point out for me and any lurkers? Thank you

Surely, when you collaborate in taking an organisation like the Tavistock and GIDS to court, the one thing you are absolutely certain about is that everything you say or do will be instantly subjected to the brightest sunlight possible.

It's kind of the point.

Interesting timing for whatever the last comments were.