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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

University staff given list of banned 'microinsults' they cannot say to trans people

545 replies

ChristinaXYZ · 01/05/2021 12:34

From the Telegraph. the last para make you want to weep -

A Newcastle University spokesman said: "We want our campus to be a welcoming and safe place for everyone who studies, works or visits here, regardless of gender, race, class, age or disability."

But it would seem they are not bothered about making people feel welcome regardless of sex, as they don't even mention it.

OP posts:
Eyewhisker · 01/05/2021 16:59

I wanted to be a boy when I was 10 and had no interest whatsoever in girls toys or girly clothes. My best friends were boys and I asked for Mecano for Christmas. When I got given a doll, I was bemused as I’d no interest in it.

Thank god this was the 80s, not now. My poor niece was not so lucky and is on hormones and awaiting a mastectomy. That is criminal.

Chersfrozenface · 01/05/2021 16:58

@blackwhiteandstripey

If a student is found to be "guilty" of a "micro aggression", what can the university do about it?

Fuck all I should imagine.

Or are we following the American model now of rounding them up and hauling them in front of kangaroo courts?

It's not aimed at students, it's aimed at the staff. The description below the title is "A Resource for Academics".
blackwhiteandstripey · 01/05/2021 16:57

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adeleh · 01/05/2021 16:56

@MissBarbary

Edinburgh University has drawn up phrases that staff cannot use, including saying "all women hate their periods" and "all people think about being the opposite gender sometimes"

In my own case both of those statements are untrue so I would not be particularly pleased at hearing them being put forward as a universal truth.

But in real life who comes out with these sorts of statements anyway? I’ve never heard anyone have these kinds of discussions . . .
Chrysanthemum5 · 01/05/2021 16:56

I think we can look to the hounding of Raquel Rosario Sanchez at Bristol to see what might happen to a student accused of one of the aggressions

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 01/05/2021 16:55

Resource co-produced by Rayya Ghul

Why do I recognise that name?

persistentwoman · 01/05/2021 16:54

@CBUK22

Is any of this actually coming from trans groups?

Or is it, like most of this Wokery being driven by middle class leftists?

Personally I'd just want to be left in peace and treated like anyone else whatever my gender identity. All this nonsense just gets peoples backs up.

This is definitely coming from the trans groups - just take a look at all the guidelines for schools demanding that girls are removed from their changing rooms if they object to undressing in front of a boy who says be's now a girl. Sad

But it is being excitedly policed by middle class lefties focussing on their "luxury beliefs". Self indulgent demands that have no care for the genuinely disadvantaged in society and are driven by some remarkably privileged individuals claiming to now be the most oppressed.

Erikrie · 01/05/2021 16:54

If a student is found to be "guilty" of a "micro aggression", what can the university do about it?

This is a fair point. Very little I would imagine. And if they did, then I am wondering how that would look in a court of law. (I suspect the outcomes could be different depending on where in the UK, of course.)

GreyhoundG1rl · 01/05/2021 16:54

@CatherinaJTV

you and me both would be barred from Edinburgh uni for stating that fact

That's just utter nonsense.

Can you expand on why?
CatherinaJTV · 01/05/2021 16:52

you and me both would be barred from Edinburgh uni for stating that fact

That's just utter nonsense.

nzborn · 01/05/2021 16:52

I was thinking that it sounds like living in that TV program.

CatherinaJTV · 01/05/2021 16:51

@CBUK22

Is any of this actually coming from trans groups?

Or is it, like most of this Wokery being driven by middle class leftists?

Personally I'd just want to be left in peace and treated like anyone else whatever my gender identity. All this nonsense just gets peoples backs up.

Resource co-produced by Rayya Ghul, IAD, University of Edinburgh in consultation with trans and non-binary students.

it says so at the bottom of each page

NecessaryScene1 · 01/05/2021 16:50

In Exeter transpeople are encouraged to say who they are happy to change in front of - but what of the choice of the other students:

Generally speaking, I think males are more comfortable revealing themselves to females than to other males. Females are just less threatening.

I think some men try to pretend that a desire for single-sex spaces is symmetrical. It definitely isn't.

If there's discomfort from a male about a mixed-sex situation, it's generally more about putting the woman in that position. Some men, of course, do not worry about that.

(In my opinion. Reminder - I'm male.)

Chrysanthemum5 · 01/05/2021 16:48

Having looked at the micro aggression resources (not just this one) has no one bothered that their complete lack of accessibility makes them an aggression against people who use screen readers?

GreyhoundG1rl · 01/05/2021 16:48

If a student is found to be "guilty" of a "micro aggression", what can the university do about it?
Excellent point.

blackwhiteandstripey · 01/05/2021 16:47

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Congressdingo · 01/05/2021 16:46

@Marcipex

My sister wanted to be a boy. Aren’t I allowed to make that remark any more?
I wanted desperately to be a boy for quite a few years, you and me both would be barred from Edinburgh uni for stating that fact, our lived experience does not trump others lived experience, apparently. What a time to be alive eh?

Absolutely anything could be considered a microaggression in the right circumstances.
On a tangentially related note, a friend and I were discussing Eddie izzard recently, funnily all those years of knowing Eddie was a male made my friend constantly forget that Eddie is now a "girl" my friend said the wrong pronouns an awful lot. That conversation could presumably not happen in Edinburgh uni now.

EndoplasmicReticulum · 01/05/2021 16:45

This is interesting from the list of microaggressions above:

"Excess focus on anatomical sex markers, most usually reproductive organs"

How does that fit with all the "people with a cervix" and "vagina havers" stuff?

toffeebutterpopcorn · 01/05/2021 16:45

They do know that rooms are usually separated by sex don’t they?

GreyhoundG1rl · 01/05/2021 16:44

@Marcipex

My sister wanted to be a boy. Aren’t I allowed to make that remark any more?
Is it a real situation? Does it reflect reality? Then, contrary to all logic... no.
Enough4me · 01/05/2021 16:43

It's not just Edinburgh. In Exeter transpeople are encouraged to say who they are happy to change in front of - but what of the choice of the other students:

"You are organising a residential trip, one of the students in the group identifies as non-binary and the accommodation is segregated by gender, what do you do?
Ask the student if they would prefer a separate,
non-gendered room and if so organise a separate
room for this student. If they are happy to
share a room ask them who they would be most
comfortable to share a room with, as they might
be happy changing in front of some course mates
but not others."

www.exeter.ac.uk/media/universityofexeter/humanresources/edi/equalityanddiversity/equalityanddiversity/toolkitcontent/2018PS023_-_Trans_Inclusion_Booklet_st4.pdf

blackwhiteandstripey · 01/05/2021 16:40

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NecessaryScene1 · 01/05/2021 16:40

Academic freedom and a commitment to freedom of expression on campus are enshrined both in law and in University policy.

@blackwhiteandstripey mentioned The Coddling of the American Mind above.

Haven't got around to it myself, but here's a good lecture by the author Jonathan Haidt:

(Executive summary: they're going to have to choose between Truth and Social Justice, and one institution can't have both be sacred. In an ideal world, you would be able to have both types of university, because some would rather have Social Justice than Truth, and some would rather have Truth).

Marcipex · 01/05/2021 16:37

My sister wanted to be a boy.
Aren’t I allowed to make that remark any more?

ElleDubloo · 01/05/2021 16:35

I wish my hospital would ban patients from asking me what country I come from.

(Answer = UK)

Not really. I’ve figured out my own polite but firm comebacks.

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