Throwing women's sport under the bus

A lot of the girls on my team can tackle the guys harder than any other guy could

And flipping it?

How hard can the men tackle the women (I assume you’re an adult, and it’s other adults you’re playing)?

A lot of the girls on my team can tackle the guys harder than any other guy could

You were making reasonable arguments up till this point, but we all know that this statement is not true.

I assume when you played mixed sex you all agreed to play mixed sex? A female playing on a women’s team is not going to be told their is a male on their team or opposing team.

So not all that relevant as far as consent goes.

Bizarrely, O J Simpson posted a video on Twitter earlier in which he criticized males who play against females in sport.

Great, but also not great as he's no friend to feminists obviously.

Height and weight because that's what RFU have proposed for allowing trans women to play.

I don't think you'll find many people here who support the RFU proposal, which seem to have been made up with nothing to actually back them apart from a vague "be inclusive" desire.

We're all about the World Rugby guidelines, which are based on actual evidence and research.

AFAIK, no national body has actually put up an argument pointing out any problems with the reasoning and evidence for the World Rugby guidelines, to justify not following them - they're just pretending they don't exist.

Like you.

willithappen: People keep asking you why rugby isn't a mixed-sex sport. Surely if it's perfectly safe, and men aren't better rugby players than women, it should be mixed sex. Why isn't it?

World rugby held a 3 day symposium on this and invited experts from both sides and at the end of it concluded that it was dangerous for men to play with and against women

Personal anecdotes v 3 day expert conference with evidence.

I’ll go with the evidence.

willithappen

Nobody needs you to prove it. The scientific case has been made. It’s fine for you not to mind but it’s not just up to you.

A lot of the girls on my team can tackle the guys harder than any other guy could

Why isn't rugby a mixed sport then? If sex makes no difference.

1. Yes I am female.
2. Height and weight because that's what RFU have proposed for allowing trans women to play. So totally relevant actually.
3. The differences - I am 9 stone, I can play and tackle and women almost double my weight on the other team. I am grassroots - I can walk into the pitch doing absolutely zero training and end up playing against an international player (which has happened - granted I personally hadn't walked on with zero training but we had players on the team where it was their first game).
4. We have 'unofficially' played with mixed men and women - like I say we don't care 😂 it's funny to me that most people who are so up in arms actually have zero involvement. (Not saying that everyone does before people jump down my throat). A lot of the girls on my team can tackle the guys harder than any other guy could :)
5. Personal experience - played with and against a couple of trans women and no issues.

Keep throwing demands for me to prove with 'science' all you like but I think I will stick to my own experience.
Also a bit crazy I can't come in and give my personal experience/opinion without everyone telling me I'm wrong 😂

I’m a women, but if I was to transgender to a man I would not play on the men’s team, that’s just dangerous, it’s not about size and weight- men are built different, and rugby players are built like stone towers!!

I just assumed the 'but, Michael Phelps' argument was coming since we have 'but all teams have all body shapes and sizes' without addressing the significant differences between weakest males vs strongest females, and the significance of different muscle types, leverage, lung and heart capacity, less likely impact on a male's brain with head injuries etc.

I look forward to seeing the science that willithappen will present that will convince me that the making these changes will make it safer for my now teen player coming through the ranks.

Love to see it willit?

You are pretty much pulling the ladder up after you regards safety for the teen players of today.

I'd assumed willithappen was male. I'm a female footballer and in my long and entirely undistinguished playing career I've played single sex, mixed sex and against a transwoman and I couldn't feel more strongly that transwomen have no place in women's sports.

[quote willithappen]@NecessaryScene1 by height and weight testing people? Because that's crazy. Women's rugby is already so vast in terms of size, weight, strength, experience etc that no argument of that makes any sense.

But I disagree - the people taking part should be the ones to say what they are comfortable with doing. Can't be that worried about the safety of women playing when it's already completely off the scale at grassroots level lol [/quote]
Let's have a think about how women's rugby team and a men's rugby team might compare. Are you seriously saying women could thrive in a game that allowed increasing numbers of trans women to play?Aside from the obvious dangers to health and life they wouldn't even be picked.

I feel I spend a lot of time posting this....

Women's rugby is already so vast in terms of size, weight, strength, experience etc that no argument of that makes any sense.

So, you don't understand the science or agree with the science behind the World Rugby decision at all then? And you obviously don't agree or understand the science about the power disparity male and female bodies (even with testosterone reduced)?

I'm a rugby player and have zero problems with allowing trans women to play in our teams or teams against us smile

That’s nice. Irrelevant, but nice.

So, are you a female then willitjappen?

Ah, good point. If willitjappen is male, then saying "I'm a rugby player and have zero problems with allowing trans women to play in our teams or teams against us" is admirable. Maybe it's trick phrasing.

And we should be asking that question - why are transwomen feeling unwelcome in male teams? Why aren't other males welcoming them.

When you refuse to put forward a rational case, others can only assume you know you don’t have one.

Can't be that worried about the safety of women playing when it's already completely off the scale at grassroots level lol

What do you mean?

by height and weight testing people?

If you really think sex differences are merely about height and weight, you seem to have rather limited knowledge.

How much mixed-sex full-contact rugby have you actually played? Have you ever faced a male of your size and weight?

Assuming you want to become more knowledgeable, a good place to start would be to listen to Ross Tucker, who was involved in organising the World Rugby trans workshop.

Why Rugby's Controversial New Transgender Guidelines Make Sense For All Sporting Codes

I know you want to "be nice", but this is serious. Treat it seriously.

Differences within sexes ie tall women, short women, muscular women are not the same as differences between the two sexes of male and female

Given what is going on in rugby with issues around concussions, head injuries and a large number of players being diagnosed with early on set dementia and other brain related problems due to numerous collisions you’d the RFU would run a mile from letting men play on women’s teams and instead go with world rugby guidance

But then the RFU has often moved in mysterious ways....

So, are you a female then willitjappen?

Have you looked at the world rugby notes about their decision? Are you perfectly happy for a transwoman who might be the height, weight and build of
Fad de Klerk, let alone Jonny Hill to play against your team?

And do you understand that you don’t have the authority to make that decision for all women?