Help explain non binary

It's so fucked up that she thinks she has to stop being a girl to do whatever she wants with her hair. How have we given this impression to the younger generation?

Has she said why she would prefer to do the sport with the boys?

They're not supposed to ask any more, so some employers make up their own minds on whether it's likely.
We've had employers on MN admit as such.

I am sure that you have probably never been asked if you had plans to be pregnant in job interview after job interview. And actually be terminated at work because you are pregnant

No, I've never.

Quite Eresh.

I think that some posters tend to forget that forced marriage, trafficked girls and FGM is something that is a problem even here in the UK. Talk about having privilege... being able to ignore the plights of these women and girls fits that description quite well.

Female infanticide at birth, as happens frequently in several parts of the world, is a heck of a family rejection. So is a family selling their daughter to sex traffickers or marrying them to an old man before they reach adolescence.

Obvs, but not vulnerable to family rejection, unemployability, bullying, and homelessness just for not being trans.

Oh dear. What about the family rejection for being born female. There are many of us here who have experienced 'unemployability' being born female. I am sure that you have probably never been asked if you had plans to be pregnant in job interview after job interview. And actually be terminated at work because you are pregnant. And if that is not hard enough, after taking the role of caring for that baby, as a female attempting to reenter employment, you get asked yet again if you are going to have more children. Then, when you reach a certain age, you face discrimination for being a female over 50.

You are so right Shizuku. No female EVER experiences unemployability and bullying.

The number of women being bullied not just in the workforce, but everywhere. At home, online.

And homelessness? Can you provide evidence that trans people are more likely to be homeless than women? Including women fleeing DV situations.

Nor do you have people on Mumsnet advising your family members to find ways to stop you being yourself, and referring them to hate groups for advice.

The privilege people have through not being trans, eh?

Yeah...... women are so privileged. Your posts continue to highlight your bias and points to a lack of knowledge about the many shared experiences of being born a female.

Obvs, but not vulnerable to family rejection, unemployability, bullying, and homelessness just for not being trans.

Well no, but all those things can certainly happen because you got pregnant or have physical issues related to your female body, obvs.

The privilege people have through not being trans, eh?

Female people benefit from FGM, sex-selective abortion, rape, forced pregnancy / birth, lack of access to contraception and sanitary protection, earn less than men, bear the brunt of child and elder care, are subject to violence and murder daily just for being women... Is that the kind of you mean. Shizuku?

Obvs, but not vulnerable to family rejection, unemployability, bullying, and homelessness just for not being trans. Nor do you have people on Mumsnet advising your family members to find ways to stop you being yourself, and referring them to hate groups for advice.

Aside from the ridicilous claims of hate groups or accusations of mumsnet advising not medicalise against puberty, it would be good if you could stop telling women they have it so good and are never allowed to fight injustice against their sex. It is infuriating that you keep coming on fwr and tell women they cannot talk about their experiences or discrimination because of their sex. Women have experienced all of the above as well, for being female. Fight for better acceptance of transpeople but not by denying other groups their experience. This is your problem, anything feminst is seen as anti trans by you.

Mail on Sunday Sanchez Manning
17 November 2018
(extract)
"An astonishing 17 pupils at a single British school are in the process of changing gender, The Mail on Sunday can reveal.

Most of the youngsters undergoing the transformation are autistic, according to a teacher there, who said vulnerable children with mental health problems were being ‘tricked’ into believing they are the wrong sex.

The whistleblower says few of the transgender children are suffering from gender dysphoria – the medical term for someone who feels they were born in the wrong body – but are just easily influenced, latching on to the mistaken belief they are the wrong sex as a way of coping with the problems caused by autism. (continues)

Older pupils at her school who changed gender ‘groomed’ younger, mainly autistic students to do the same;

One autistic teenager is soon to have a double mastectomy;

Pupils who say they were born the wrong sex mimic transgender YouTube stars Carol believes are partly to blame for convincing vulnerable children they have gender dysphoria.

Last night, Conservative MP David Davies said: ‘I congratulate this teacher for coming out and telling us what I have long suspected has been going on in schools. It is horrendous that children are being encouraged by other pupils to identify as transgender, particularly if they have autism." (continues)

‘Once she was involved with that group there was no turning back,’ she says. ‘It was decided that she was transgender and that was that, it was never challenged and I blame myself for that.’

Carol now firmly believes that the student never suffered from gender dysphoria – the medical term for someone who feels they were born in the wrong body – but was simply autistic and should have been offered more help to cope with their emotional and social difficulties.

What makes this even more painful for Carol and is one of the reasons she has chosen to speak out today is that she has learned the girl is planning a double mastectomy as part of her gender realignment." (continues)
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6401593/Whistleblower-teacher-makes-shocking-claim-autistic.html

Intersectionality reminds us that we can be privileged in some ways and disadvantaged in other ways.

I suppose the question is whether being 'cis' confers a privilege that tends to outweigh other privileges - whether social, economic or biological.

Male privilege is pretty extensive.

Biologically it includes considerable impact on day to day life - no risk or fear of becoming pregnant, no menstruation. Males generally don't require use of contraception that may interfere with their health. No childbirth to consider - a huge risk for female health. Males' health issues are more likely to be researched, their concerns more likely to be listened than female ones. Of course, males die younger, so there may be a point at which male privilege becomes a disadvantage, health wise.

If you were born male, you will have experienced male socialisation, possibly even from before birth. Socialised to believe you are the dominant or superior sex. This tends to encourage the idea we have a 'right' to talk more, that our views are more worthy of respect. Hence mansplaining, etc.

The world is largely built around males and male privilege. History is a long 'his story'. Most people in power are still male. Etc.

So males are, as a class, hugely privileged over females.

Whatever their 'gender identity', male privilege is a far more pervasive, significant and powerful privilege than so-called 'cis' privilege.

Are you suggesting there aren't countless male born people who've benefited from male privilege who have transitioned? I'll stop going off at a tangent now, but really.

A couple of my dd's friends have come out as non-binary. As far as I can ascertain, it seems to mean that they don't feel like they fit into either of the stereotypical gender roles, but rather than questioning whether those stereotypical gender roles are actually valid, they have instead reached the conclusion that they need to change their pronouns to they/them. I don't really understand it tbh - I don't really know why they can't just be boys/girls who don't fit the stereotype - but I'm happy to go along with the pronouns if that's what makes them feel validated.

I have been very honest with dd about the fact that I don't buy into the concept of gender. I don't know what it is, and nobody has yet been able to explain what "feeling like a woman" or "feeling like a man" actually means. Essentially, dd is also sceptical, as she too rejects the gender stereotypes while continuing to use female pronouns/"identify" as a girl. However, she is eager to respect how her friends feel, and as I have brought her up to be kind and considerate towards others, I try to support this. Privately, I do think it's all nonsense, but I have no wish to upset troubled young people, and so I will play along as required.

Oh no - you found the 2 people who perfectly represent the experiences of the average trans person and now my argument has fallen apart!

It is usually sarcasm that causes your arguments to fall apart.

"I for one am certain the likes of Pippa Bunce and Eddie Izzard are way less privileged than the women I know."

Oh no - you found the 2 people who perfectly represent the experiences of the average trans person and now my argument has fallen apart!

Obvs, but not vulnerable to family rejection, unemployability, bullying, and homelessness just for not being trans. Nor do you have people on Mumsnet advising your family members to find ways to stop you being yourself, and referring them to hate groups for advice.

The thread concerns an 11 year old autistic child, not an adult who identifies as transgender.
Appropriating and attempting to misframe her family member's concerns about how to best support her within her family is poor behaviour to witness on a parenting site.
Nobody has signposted to resurces of a 'hate group'

If you don't think LGBT bullying at school is a thing, you should read this 2017 survey:

www.stonewall.org.uk/system/files/the_school_report_2017.pdf

[quote Educationneeded]@Lovemusic33 being non binary does make her more vulnerable though. As I’ve explained she is already being bullied at school and now she is making herself stand out even more. All of the girls in her year call her weird. They’ve had to buddy her up with someone from the year below as she will spend break and lunch time completely alone otherwise.[/quote]
My dd has been bullied throughout school (now 17), she stands out because she has ASD, her coming out as pansexual has not made things worse, if anything it has improved, she now helps run the school LGBT+ group and has made friends through this, she’s now in 6 form so no longer wearing school uniform, her dress sense I guess is non binary, she dresses different than her friends but she has friends and they except her for who she is, both her best friends are straight. I don’t think it makes her more vulnerable, if anything it’s made her less vulnerable and more confident because she is being who she wants to be.