Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Well, that's us told

358 replies

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 13/04/2021 20:14

lux-magazine.com/article/the-road-to-terfdom/

This is an article about Mumsnet FWR boards. Author doesn't like us. Oh dear.

OP posts:
Delphinium20 · 14/04/2021 18:29

@StrangeLookingParasite

And South Australia in 1894, Western Australia in 1899, and Australia as a whole in 1902 (could be wrong). Certainly all of Australia by 1911.

New Zillund Zealand (all of it) in 1893, too.

My favorite stat on women getting the right to vote is the state of Wyoming in 1870. Low-population state that felt more voices = better representation.

And those Nordic regions before Christianity, allowing women to speak and divorce at will!!!

Sophoclesthefox · 14/04/2021 18:25

Well, isn’t that an interesting connection, R0.

It’s so good you’re back Smile

WiseUpJanetWeiss · 14/04/2021 18:23

@GoingThruTheMotions

I prefer this plop.
I loved reading this to DS.

“You are what you are”, his parents told him, wisely.

R0wantrees · 14/04/2021 18:21

Independent by Nora Mulready
'I sympathised with gender-critical campaigners – until my nephew came out as trans
I clutched at everything I could find to validate my instinct that transgender identities were a millennial fad. But when I stopped to listen to my trailblazing sister, I saw that her son was thriving'
Thursday 27 August 2020

www.independent.co.uk/voices/transgender-gender-critical-recognition-act-jk-rowling-lgbt-a9687576.html

Nora Mulready's 'trail blazing sister' Molly Mulready is a lawyer closely involved with Jolyon Maugham, the GLP and its 'Legal Defence Fund for Transgender Lives' goodlawproject.org/update/advisory-group-transgender/

NoSquirrels · 14/04/2021 17:59

What an absolutely MARVELLOUS article.

I mean - it was very long-winded, and seemed to go in circles a bit, but it did do an comprehensive job of representing how Mumsnet is a catalyst for women who want to consider biology important to feminism.

"How wrong I was to underestimate Mumsnet."

LOLs.

I particularly enjoyed the conclusion:

My reporting on MRAs hasn’t found many solutions. In the long run, I hope that there will be an ever-growing movement for gender liberation that sweeps up mums in its embrace, leaving the toxic forums to wither. But the only individual solution that seems to work, anecdotally, is having long conversations with family members like Mulready did.

SUBMIT TO THE GROUPTHINK. BE KIND, MUMS. BE KIND.

That isn’t going to be easy.

When one commenter posted that she was “at the end of my tether with my mother, who has become engulfed in the gender critical discourse mainly thanks to this website” this stated attempt at an “open discussion” garnered 1,000 comments. In the end, the original poster only responded to a few. Perhaps she was a troll, as some commenters surmised, or maybe she was overwhelmed by the Mumsnetters, who called her a “midnight misogynist” and told her to “listen to her mum.”

Katie J.M. Baker is a reporter based in London.

Wonder if Katie did in fact, "listen to her mum" in the end? Wink

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/04/2021 17:44

It's a bastardised form of "intersectionality" that doesn't recognise being female as an intersecting axis of oppression.

Kimchidreams · 14/04/2021 17:40

Exactly @R0wantrees. TRAs and their handmaidens talk about intersectionality all the time, however they don’t listen to the voices of actual black women who don’t agree with their ideology and who care about the erosion of women’s rights. We have skin in the game, you know, being women and all Hmm.

EdgeOfACoin · 14/04/2021 17:22

@GoingThruTheMotions

I prefer this plop.
Awww, I loved that book as a child, GoingThru!
yourhairiswinterfire · 14/04/2021 17:19

@Viviennemary

I think they've got a point. Only on MN is this rampant frothing over trans men or is it trans women. If this was any other minority group there would be hell to pay. I think folk should give it a rest.,
I'll give it a rest and stop my ''rampant frothing'' when:

-lobby groups stop trying to remove my sex as a protected characteristic from the Equality Act
-when lesbians and gay men aren't piled on, reported to the police and their employers for the crime of being same sex attracted, rather than same gender attracted.
-when rapists aren't being housed with vulnerable female inmates because the rapists wishes come before the human rights of women
-when paedophiles aren't spared jail over and over again because them undergoing reassignment apparently makes them more vulnerable than children
-when sportswomen aren't at risk of having their spines snapped because bio males have ''folded them like deckchairs''
-when sportswomen aren't at risk of having their skulls cracked open because they have to fight someone with a massive biological advantage, else they'll be labelled a transphobe and lose their career they've worked damn hard for
-when healthy children aren't being given experimental treatment with hormones that have no proven benefits but plenty of negatives

And this isn't 'only on MN'. This is one of the very few places that allows these discussions to take place, so it may seem that way, but it's not.

Every single person I know in real life is horrified by what is happening under the guise of ''progressiveness''. Every one, from the teens to the elders, females and males.

Zinco · 14/04/2021 17:06

Don’t worry, we’ve been monitoring Mumsnet, so we can report back on what these mums are really thinking and the reasons why they’ve got their knickers in a twist. No, we didn’t ask any of them to write an article themselves, because they won’t understand why they behave the way they do. They’re just mums.

Lol.

Yes, it would maybe be nice if sites like that gave a right of reply to the other perspective. But that would be "platforming hate" of course.

R0wantrees · 14/04/2021 17:06

Well said! I’m so fed up of their assertion that gender critical women are all white and middle class. Well I’m not white and very much GC, so seems like I didn’t get the memo! Do they think that we lack the critical reasoning skills to see through their nonsense? I think they trot this out repeatedly, because they wouldn’t know how to debate with a GC Black or Asian woman. Hierarchy of oppression or some such.

Kimchidreams The audacity of white women and men claiming some sort of imagined race oppression whilst ignoring the voices of GC black or asian women is shocking.

HotTomatoes · 14/04/2021 17:05

What a patronising, hateful load of old tosh.

So we are all TERFs, ‘Karens’ and petty little Hyacinth Bucket characters who’ve got nothing better to do than get hysterical about transwomen using our toilets? Took a LOT of words to say that, though, didn’t it? Blimey.

What is WRONG with people, though? Can we now only actually think/write using sexist stereotypes, social media shorthand and other lazy fucking assumptions?

Water my fucking begonias? No, Katie. I’m just more interested in smashing the patriarchy than I am with pandering to a minority of men who aren’t happy with the body they were born in to. I’m sorry if that’s not ‘kind’.

alkanet · 14/04/2021 17:00

Plop, how appropriate😂💩

ErrolTheDragon · 14/04/2021 16:59

Maybe something so palpably false as to act as a lump of concrete in the track causing a derail? ....what was this thread discussing before that odd interjection?

GoingThruTheMotions · 14/04/2021 16:58

I prefer this plop.

Well, that's us told
RufustheSniggeringReindeer · 14/04/2021 16:57

@Sophoclesthefox

It was a plop

Pfffft, and I’ve wasted pixels being nice as well. Hrmppph.

I don’t know when it stops being a plop and turns into an interesting debate

Id like to say its when the poster reappears but im fairly positive that im being incredibly optimistic

Sophoclesthefox · 14/04/2021 16:53

It was a plop

Pfffft, and I’ve wasted pixels being nice as well. Hrmppph.

RufustheSniggeringReindeer · 14/04/2021 16:49

@alkanet

Infertile, childless, menopausal post. Was that a drive by posting?
It was a plop

Big smelly pointless fake news plop

CardinalLolzy · 14/04/2021 16:45

@alkanet

Infertile, childless, menopausal post. Was that a drive by posting?
Clearly that post was so objectively incorrect as to invite comment, in my opinion.

Genuinely though, I have seen TW proudly proclaim they are now exactly biologically the same as post-menopausal women with endometriosis.

alkanet · 14/04/2021 16:42

Infertile, childless, menopausal post. Was that a drive by posting?

Datun · 14/04/2021 16:36

Add that to "gender critical" attacks on infertile/childless/menopausal women and you see why GCs are so unpopular.

I'm mulling over this piece of nonsense and wondering if it's because it's called mumsnet.

And an assumption that not only is everyone here a mum, but it's a cliquey elitist sort of membership which excludes you if you're not actively doing 'mum stuff'.

Hence infertile, childless and menopausal.

And shows that not only is the poster clueless about this site, but hasn't read the article either.

Makes me itch.

Sophoclesthefox · 14/04/2021 16:23

@PumpkinSpiceWoman, please would you explain what you mean by attacks on child free/infertile/menopausal women, as I am all three of those things and have never been criticised by someone gender critical because of it.

I’ll tell you what has happened though, and that is that transallies have told me that the phrase “only women can get pregnant” excludes infertile women, and I’ve pointed out that it doesn’t, and I am not in the least offended.

Conversely, I’ve pointed out that the terminology like “menstruators” or “cervix havers” is upsetting for someone like me as it feels very othering and excluding me from womanhood for not menstruating and not having a cervix.

None of it has come from gender critical feminists, though. Could you maybe explain what you mean?

PotholeHellhole · 14/04/2021 16:22

I'm white and used to live in a single-sex homelessness hostel. This perspective informs my GCness today, and I am not up for being called smug and privileged by a lady who, by her own testimony, usually comes to MN for advice on how to clean a... dishwasher.

alkanet · 14/04/2021 16:14

Erm, childfree and menopausal here. Never felt my choice to remain childless has been attacked or even questioned by GC femenists. Perhaps it's because they respect women and however they choose to organize their lives?

Biscuitsanddoombar · 14/04/2021 16:04

GC attacks on child free or infertile women?

What utter bollocks. As an infertile woman, I’ve told several trans activists attempting to draw parallels between infertile and being a man to get in the proverbial sea

GC women on here have always being unfailingly supportive around infertility

Honestly what is this parallel reality some posters seems to occupy??