He. These are not our crimes.

You've confused 2 different things there. No one takes offence when using the words "girl" and "woman" unless you are talking to or about a group of people that includes, or may include trans men and non-binary people, in which case, it can be helpful to use more inclusive language.

Well do you know what, I fucking take offence when people use the word 'girl' or 'woman' for a male, yes A MALE, A MAN, who downloads images of babies being raped and I think it would be 'helpful' to use factually correct language. But no one gives a shit about that do they? No one is falling over themselves not to offend me? Why not?

This is just such fucking horseshit, I can't even believe my eyes sometimes.

No one takes offence when using the words "girl" and "woman" unless you are talking to or about a group of people that includes, or may include trans men and non-binary people, in which case, it can be helpful to use more inclusive language.

They do if those words are applied to a predatory male. It's not just denying reality, it's insulting to all the women who've been victims of male predators in the past.

here’s another admittedly clearly vulnerable but born a man, found guilty of breaching a SPHO having been found guilty of viewing images of child abuse and spared jail 🤷🏼‍♀️

This is why language matters when we are talking about crime and convicted offenders:

www.keep-prisons-single-sex.org.uk/use-of-language

FPFW are doing some work in this area:

fairplayforwomen.com/ipso/

I just hope they get results. And soon.

"Penis person who specifically used their penis to commit the most heinous act possible" That seems like a fair compromise.

HermitsLife , how about “teenaged person with a penis who downloaded”?

In the spirit of menstruators and ovary owners etc?

I wonder if it would be ok to refer to certain people as “penis people” or “penis person” if we want to avoid the word woman in these contexts?

I feel quite relaxed about the pronouns as long as it is clear that it refers to a person with a penis. It seems to be ok for the NHS to avoid sex/gender and just refer to sexual organs so maybe this would be the solution everyone on this thread could be happy with?

I'd like to know what type of a crime a person living under a different identity would need to commit before this whole shambles starts to be taken seriously. Would they need to be in the John Worboys / Jimmy Saville / Steve Wright territory before people in authority realise what everyone else with an ounce of sense can see with their own two eyes?

[quote LiveLuvLaugh]@GNCQ I think the "pregnant people, uterus haver" brigade advocate these as collective terms not to be used when talking to or about individuals. [/quote]
Right.
So the rules are, in PSHE, health (etc) you're supposed to refer to groups of people as "people with a penis" or "people with a vagina" rather than man/woman/girl/boy.

Then when an individual gets referred to as a "person with a penis" or even the reducted version- "person" suddenly this is all terrible and against the rules.

Of course. All very clear

(By the way my comment is in no way aimed at you directly LiveLoveLaugh I just picked it up because I'm sure we're both trying to work out "the rules").

You've confused 2 different things there. No one takes offence when using the words "girl" and "woman" unless you are talking to or about a group of people that includes, or may include trans men and non-binary people, in which case, it can be helpful to use more inclusive language.

Girl and woman are inclusive terms for all human beings who are female, whether children or adults and irrespective of their gender identity (or lack thereof).

"It's fucking ridiculous, people tie themselves up in knots to avoid using the words 'girl/woman' for fear of offense..... Except when talking about a male wanting to rape babies, then the word 'girl' is perfectly appropriate?"

You've confused 2 different things there. No one takes offence when using the words "girl" and "woman" unless you are talking to or about a group of people that includes, or may include trans men and non-binary people, in which case, it can be helpful to use more inclusive language.

@GNCQ I think the "pregnant people, uterus haver" brigade advocate these as collective terms not to be used when talking to or about individuals.

Why are people tagging someone who hasn't made a comment in this thread?

It's fucking ridiculous, people tie themselves up in knots to avoid using the words 'girl/woman' for fear of offense..... Except when talking about a male wanting to rape babies, then the word 'girl' is perfectly appropriate?

Fuck off.

@Shizuku what's your point? That women do it too? Yes we know women do it too, we can see this when we look at the statistics. The statistics that say that over 98% of sexual crime is perpetrated by males and just under 2% is perpetrated by females, with nearly all of these involving a male as well (Colin Blanchard being 'the hub of the paedophile wheel' in the Plymouth case).

Yes, women do it too, Vanessa George and Angela Allen come into that 2% category. Which category does Denen Anderson come into?

@shizuku. How do you know she is female?

www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/paedophile-woman-who-shared-vile-3700779

It's absolutely absurd to let criminals dictate how they're referred to. And I know it's supposed to be about relevance but this is absolutely relevant. As is any behaviour which is sexually motivated.

It's just as relevant when for example a transwoman is complaining about not being able to access sex shops on the train WiFi. This is male behaviour and it has nothing to do with women. It don't have to be crime far; it's about misleading the public about male and female behaviour patterns.

The only time I can see it's irrelevant is if the news story is about who grew the biggest dahlias or won the prize for the best cake in the village show. Or being a victim of a burglary or something.

Yes unfortunately it's Scotland isn't it. Our equivalent of woke r us Canada.

I've emailed the editor to ask on what basis they're reporting this person to be female, as they clearly have no GRC and are male. I'm interested to see the response, although I assume it'll be some whitewash crap.