Anyone fancy co-parenting with LOJ?

The idea that to grow a baby you just need a womb is an extremely misogynist view shared by anti abortion types.

It's woman as vessel. You'll note that anti abortion pics always show the foetus floating in space. The woman is invisible, not relevant. Oh why not just give it up for adoption they say. As if carrying a baby to term, childbirth are nothing.

What happened with formula was an example of this. Oh breast milk is just something women do. All mammals do it. Science can do better, obviously.

But they keep finding new stuff about how it works, what's in it etc

The arrogance of it.

This idea oh just get a human womb and put it anywhere fine. The idea that women's bodies interact with, nourish, react to the foetus is just. Not of interest.

The interest in improving things for pregnant and birthing women is, where? Not much in evidence.

The interest in growing babies without women has been interesting forever. For men especially. The one thing they really need us for.

suppression of testosterone

I was wondering about this. When I started losing my hair (initially started as female pattern hair loss/Androgenetic alopecia) I was looking into possible treatments and Spironolactone came up. A testosterone blocker. It's believed that FPHL is caused by the hair follicles being very sensitive to the tiny, normal amount of androgens women produce.

I assume transwomen take testosterone suppressants? (Someone please correct me if I'm wrong). It was stressed so much that you absolutely should not get pregnant when on Spironolactone, because it causes birth defects in baby boys. I think their penis doesn't develop properly, amongst other risks. You have to come off the medication for months before trying to conceive. Same with Minoxidil, a foam you rub on your scalp to stimulate hair growth. Birth defects have been reported the same as with Spiro, because it's an anti-androgen.

So, if transwomen take testosterone suppressants, how could they become pregnant safely? And they wouldn't be able to come off them during a pregnancy, because surely the testosterone they'd start producing naturally would be extremely dangerous for the baby, and clash with all the other artificial female hormones needed to sustain the pregnancy?

If any branch of medical science is going to devote itself to understanding and artificially replicating anything the human body does, can it be replicating breastmilk/improving cows milk-based formula formulation to more closely copy human milk?

That would be fantastic. Both for women who don't want to breast feed and for women who want to, but can't due to circumstances beyond their control.

Spot on

Of course, I do have to admit that if testes have been removed, there is no testosterone to suppress. Still doesn’t mean the other chemicals being taken are healthy for a baby.

Oh dear. We are onto males receiving womb transplants AGAIN.

Posters who believe it possible to carry a foetus as a male have obviously never been there throughout a pregnancy with an intimate partner or/and have been sold hope by people who have not told these males the entire story.

And no matter how regular posters on this board try to explain, it is ignored.

Please. Take it from Mumsnet posters who either have been pregnant and some posters may even be doctors, nurses and midwives with huge knowledge.

A uterus is not the only thing needed to carry a foetus. Unless you can also reprogram MOST of your body, and not just with hormones, you cannot do this. From your body’s programming taking calcium from your teeth as needed, to an intricate feedback loop to provide different things at different times to the developing infant and your own body, it is NOT just the uterus!

A female body is designed to do it, so a transplant will work. It has all the other programming too. I believe there is still many issues.

However, the chemical cocktail already taken by a transwoman, and the unreliability of suppression of testosterone, cannot be healthy for a developing infant either. There are so many chemicals, even foods, females must be careful of, why on earth do any males think this would be for the good of another human being???

And what about the ethics for experimenting on unborn children? Are posters who post this stuff prepared to also take on the responsibility for allowing unborn children to be experiment ‘material’.

Any person who advocates for males to carry foetuses must accept their role in history for experimenting with unborn children. There will be no where to hide.

Can't he ask Suzanne Moore to help out? I'll just get me coat then.....

I'm still laughing that @shizuku thinks a woman receiving a womb transplant is somehow evidence that a trans women/biological male could receive one. You understand there's quite a significant, fundamental difference between the two, yeah? And zero concern mentioned for the baby of course. Just looking forward to trans women being able to stick it to the bigots. Very revealing.

Honestly every single time you post, lurkers are reading and seeing the gaping holes in your arguments. You aren't doing your cause any favours. But it is hilarious to watch.

OJ says nothing about his partner (no idea if he has one).

The whole idea of co-parenting between 3/4 parents (or even potentially more if couples split by design rather than by unfortunate circumstance doesn't strike me as being in the best interests of the child tbh.

But yeah. I guess I'm a bigot. shrugs I am not longer particularly bothered by the slur. Esecially if its one thrown about by OJ

Empress

I know it’s a rhetorical question but I wouldn’t expect ovaries to function.... unless we really are talking pure sci fi with a fully functioning, genetically altered ‘dual sex’ person. My thought was impregnation via donor egg or eggs somehow ripened and extracted prior to implantation from the ovaries of the donor uterus and this theoretical and apparently easy implantation method doesn’t include ovaries... and transmen seeking hysterectomy could consider donating their uteruses. obgyn.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1471-0528.15438

True. And maybe they could even find a way to grow their own eggs, or would they also be provided with fully stocked ovaries?

If ever a person born with male gametes were able to have a womb implanted, wouldn’t it be easier to impregnate themselves than expecting a transwoman to do the job?

Well blow me down, Tinsel. Satire is impossible these days.

They tweeted then deleted this. Speaks volumes...

OT but I am delighted that whenever I see SapphosRock post now I shall imagine her surrounded by tiny vikings

 they're not so tiny Gibbons - my kids are made of strong Viking stock. Won't be long before they tower over me and DW.

Every time I want some intelligent and insightful political commentary Jedward are the first people that come to mind, always.

Let's be honest OJ contacted them because they share his brand of misogyny. But fucking hell, Jedward, is OJ struggling to get guests on his new channel.

Back to the subject at hand, wombs are not plug and play.

That's exactly what it's about. Incredibly ugly post there from our friend Shizuku.

Hopefully womb transplants for trans women will be a thing soon, cos it'll be so much fun watching bigots imploding when a trans woman offers to be a surrogate for a gay couple

It's not about wanting a child then. Just getting one over on women. Using their transplanted organs. Lovely. Not that I could imagine a queue of women willing to donate. So I don't think it's likely to be a regular occurrence even if it does become technically possible.

It's already been done with women who don't happen to be trans way to bury the lede there

OT but I am delighted that whenever I see SapphosRock post now I shall imagine her surrounded by tiny vikings

Could there possibly be a gigantic whiff of the most monstrous hypocrisy going on here,

Yeah, the activists made these rules, and now seem upset that people are actually playing by them. It's not homophobia when it comes from them, it's 'progressive', but us applying their own logic and rules to this situation absolutely is homophobia.

Someone make it make sense!

If they're busy, maybe The Cheeky Girls could discuss Corbyn's comeback tour?

Well, me and the gynaecologists and transplant experts who wrote this paper:

Gynaecologists and transplant specialists are not fertility experts. You don't seem to realise there's a bit more to it than sticking a womb in and hoping it takes.