Chauvin trial re George Floyd - Sky News

Surely police officers will be trained to deal with people high on drugs, having a panic attack, etc? It can't be a rare occurrence!

“Why don’t we take a perfectly healthy person who has never had a drink, taken opioids or had a hard life and step on his neck for 8 minutes and 46 seconds and see what happens.” (taken off Twitter)

I don’t know how the official verdict will go but I hope those those police officers live in shame and despair at what they’ve done. Maybe also for America to pause and look at itself and its justice system.

I watched a couple of secs of Tim Pool's video and that was enough to convince me that if his is a popular view in the US then I am very glad I do not live there. Also some of the replies to his tweets

The defence are arguing that a) George Floyd conveniently died of a drug OD at exactly the same time as Chauvin was kneeling on his neck and b) Chauvin was only 'doing as he was told' using a legitimate restraint technique that he had been taught.

Floyd was an admitted opiate addict and had Fentanyl in his system and he had OD before. I still think it beggars belief to think that having their airway compressed for 9 minutes has nothing to do with a persons death. It's arse over tit. The drugs might have made him more likely to die in that scenario but he would still not have died if he had not been restrained like that.

Do they seriously teach them to kneel on people's necks for 9 minutes as a legitimate restraint technique in Minneapolis?
Because in the U.K. it is well known that prolonged prone restraint kills people at least since the death of Rocky Bennet in 1998 and any restraint in that position would be timed and kept to a minimum.

I don't suppose Derek Chauvin set out to or intended to kill George Floyd but he took no care to preserve his life. Floyd's death was a reasonably foreseeable consequence of his actions. This is self evident as it was forseen by all those on the street who tried to stop it. Isn't that at least manslaughter (I have no idea what US charges mean)?

That Lietenant's testimony was very damning for Chauvin.

What you say about conviction is true ancientgran. I couldn't believe it when the cop there who shot Philando Castile got off.

Thank you @BelleHathor I'll have a good look at those links.

I've no idea if any of the other cops worked as bouncers too or even why that's allowed. If they knew him they should be charged with murder too.

Presumably he knew his history and knew he was a drug user etc. He could of thought a thousand different things. IMO it changes it to murder if he knew him and was motivated by that.

It doesn't change what happened but it might explain why Chauvin thought he could get away with it.

Why would it explain that? It might provide a reason as to why it happened, possibly, but it doesn't provide a reason as to why he would get away with it.

When this case first hit the headlines I read that Floyd and Chauvin both knew each other personally as they had worked together as bouncers. But I've never seen this stated on the news.

Does anyone know if it is true?

It doesn't change what happened but it might explain why Chauvin thought he could get away with it.

In the USA I think female officers are involved in these types of situations. If you're armed with a gun it changes the power dynamic.

Agree that the reason for this post being in feminism is... Well we just have to guess don't we.

A female police officer I expect might try harder to talk Floyd down and use less aggressive methods as she knows she cannot rely on brute strength. Maybe more women in high U.K. positions in the police force would change the culture positively

I absolutely think it would.

In U.K. MH settings it is increasingly being seen as a failure and a dangerous step to involve police when mentally ill people are aggressive after several black mentally ill men died due to police involvement. It is recognised that there should be other ways to de-escalate and manage aggression that are safer.

And this he to be repeated, this his to be the focus- changing the culture, changing the methods used etc.

Im in no way defending the police officer's behaviour but have you actually seen the whole footage from the beginning of the arrest? He was being difficult and they tried to sit him in the car, he refused and demanded to be put on the floor. He was clearly as high as a kite and behaving unpredictably

I watched it again last night, and it is so upsetting. I don't think it matters that he was high as a kite and behaving unpredictability. This is the nature of policing and some of the people that they need to manage will be presenting like this. The police force need to find a way to ensure that that person who has taken loads of drugs do not end up dead following arrest. Or at any rate, if they do end up dead, it shouldn't be because of something the police did, or didn't do that caused that. There must be other methods of restraining someone that doesn't involve a knee on the neck. It shouldn't be a recognised and legal strategy. At the very least the police lay themselves open to blame, and at the very worst, as in this case, they have a dead man, a murder trial, and questions that must be answered.

Cattenberg I have no idea, may be that GF would continue to lie quiet and still, may be that he would become unconscious? Maybe he was happy to inflict unnecessary harm? But as you say, he doesn't have a serious mental impairment so it seems unlikely that if he set out to kill someone he would think this was the most risk-free method (in terms of outcomes for himself). I suspect it likely he disregarded any pain or suffering he was inflicting and didn't think much more on the outcome beyond a satisfaction he had got his man.

MabelPines has a good point

Police brutality can be seen as a further outworking of male violence

A female police officer I expect might try harder to talk Floyd down and use less aggressive methods as she knows she cannot rely on brute strength. Maybe more women in high U.K. positions in the police force would change the culture positively.

In U.K. MH settings it is increasingly being seen as a failure and a dangerous step to involve police when mentally ill people are aggressive after several black mentally ill men died due to police involvement. It is recognised that there should be other ways to de-escalate and manage aggression that are safer.

Tibtom, what do you think Chauvin expected to happen as a result of his actions? Passers by were warning him, yet he carried on. I couldn’t bear to watch the whole video, but apparently he carried on kneeling on George Floyd’s neck after Floyd had lost consciousness.

I don’t think the defence are arguing that Chauvin has a serious mental impairment. He must have known that if he didn’t stop kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, Floyd would die. Chauvin made the decision not to stop.

Whether the officers involved at the scene are racist or not is actually irrelevant - the whole US police system is inherently racist. To deny that is to deny reality.

He should be found guilty, and sent to prison for a very long time.

But he shouldn't be found guilty because the systems is racist. If he is found guilty it should be because of his actions.

For murder or attempted murder in the uk you would have to be setting out to kill someone. I not sure they are trying to say that?