Suicide rate of those who have undergone reassignment

I knew more than one gay who was beaten to death on the street for being gay.

So far I know nobody trans who has suffered that fate.

There was a certain amount of urgency about the GLF.

I don't believe there is trans agenda anymore than there was ever a gay agenda. Just a small minority pushing for long yearned for progress.

But progress to what exactly? What's the end goal here? What needs to happen on the ground for you to say it's been achieved?

As an adult in her thirties with three children I had a long and difficult struggle with various doctors to convince them that I didn't want any more children and I wanted to be sterilised please. They constantly wished me to affirm that I really meant it, that even if one of my children were killed in an accident I would still mean it, and so on

Indeed! Since November last year I have been having monitoring and treatment for post menopausal bleeding. Thankfully, the histology reports came back 'benign'. I suggested to my consultant that I may like to have a hysterectomy; after all I am post menopausal and can no longer bear children, and I felt it may be better to have my uterus removed as a precaution against further symptoms.

I was told that there were no valid clinical reasons for this serious procedure, and that furthermore it was a procedure with the potential for serious risk or side effect. I decided not to proceed with this request; but have since had more spotting and am now scheduled for another scan on Monday, where we will once again discuss the possibility.

Justhadathought
There is most definitely an element of social contagion about this. I imagine you might say that many of these young women were not really trans ( especially the many who then go on to detransition/desist); but they certainly felt convinced enough, and their adult counsellors and medical advisors were obviously happy enough to perform mastectomies and hysterectomies on them.

This is a factor I find very worrying. A hysterectomy is not something to go into without a great deal of thought, unless not having one is life-threatening in some way. (No general anaesthetic surgery ought to be, really.)

As an adult in her thirties with three children I had a long and difficult struggle with various doctors to convince them that I didn't want any more children and I wanted to be sterilised please. They constantly wished me to affirm that I really meant it, that even if one of my children were killed in an accident I would still mean it, and so on.

It seems as if the incidental sterilisation of women in their teens has now become a matter of unimportance.

Why should this be? What is is about a childless female of that age which makes her able to confirm with confidence she will never want to have even one child, when a fully adult woman was thought to be so unable to confirm that she would not want more children? The double standard in this does seem to me to be a matter for concern.

I don't believe there is trans agenda anymore than there was ever a gay agenda. Just a small minority pushing for long yearned for progress. It's a term that carries with it negative connotations though so I suppose it's a useful bit of language for journalists to use to gee up their readership a little

in this case the journalists are taking their lead from the grassroots movement of people who are maybe involved with services for women and children, for example; or from people, including many of the people who post here, who have been at the sharp edge of 'matters' in their personal and professional lives.

There is definitely an agenda, otherwise politicians such as Crispin Blunt would not have to act so consciously with deception, in order to push things, which really must be debated, through parliament without public notice. There are lots of funds coming out of the U.S, particularly, to further this agenda.

I wouldn't say it needs an adult understanding any more than being gay or knowing you are not trans does

There are numerous accounts from people ( who grew up to be gay/lesbian) who when children and adolescents would have jumped at the chance of being trans, if that narrative had been a common or available one at that time.

The actor Rupert Everett, for instance , talks about this. and many women here have spoken about the same; before they matured and realised they were lesbians, or simply gender non-conforming females.

Lots/most of gay people have struggled with their feelings around identity and sexuality when young.....and many much older people even entered heterosexual marriages in order to avoid or suppress the reality.

What we see in more recent times is many young women, who have first come out as lesbian, then move on towards coming out as trans.
There is most definitely an element of social contagion about this. I imagine you might say that many of these young women were not really trans ( especially the many who then go on to detransition/desist); but they certainly felt convinced enough, and their adult counsellors and medical advisors were obviously happy enough to perform mastectomies and hysterectomies on them.

We all utilise and adopt the dominant narratives available in our time, in order to better express ourselves. This has always been the case, throughout history.

Aside from all that, I'm often interested to know why some people believe we can be trans adults but not trans children almost as if they can place an 18 rated certificate on a well documented medical condition?

For me, it’s a question of whether trans is used as it once was, to mean someone who is transitioning (medical pathway of some kind) or whether we accept that trans is some invisible and ill-defined mental state.

The problem lies in the sheer vagueness of the latter description. For what it’s worth, I don’t believe children should be on a medical pathway as that is a decision that requires full adult understanding of the long-term, very significant effects.

I also think society would be much healthier if the lines between clothes and styles for boys and girls were differentiated less and anyone could wear anything they wanted. I think the pressure to transition would be much lower if there was no stigma if boys wanted to wear dresses and play with soft toys. In a society where that was wholly acceptable, then I think it would be much easier for children to reach adulthood without making the choice as to whether they want to pursue a medical pathway.

It’s recognised that stigma causes mental health problems in those who don’t conform to gender norms, but I suspect stigma at a very young age, when the sense of who we are is being formed, might well be a very significant driver in the formation of gender dysphoria.

Realising around the time of puberty who you are attracted to is completely different. You must be able to see this.

I don't think there needs to be a lower age limit to have an awareness. It's not something people need protecting from. I don't know about the baby thing, I'm not aware of any memory before being 3 or 4. I started to have an awareness and a recognisable discomfort at about 5 years old. I definitely couldn't articulate it at that age though. I was probably about 10 or 11 when it all made some sort of sense, about the same time I became aware that I fancied boys. Neither were going to set me up for a happy adolescence but, it turned out okay in the end. I think it information had been a more available and in a more supportive environment I may have been able to join the dots a couple of years earlier.

Some people, like Diane Ehrensaft, think very young children (even babies) can know they're trans. Do you also believe this? If not, how old do they need to be before they're old enough to know?

No, but they don't need to be an adult to know they are gay, trans or both.

Society became more accepting

But according to another poster, the distress which trans people experience is because society is not accepting.

I wouldn't say it needs an adult understanding any more than being gay

So a child can know that they are gay or trans before they understand about sex and sexuality?

I don't believe there is trans agenda anymore than there was ever a gay agenda. Just a small minority pushing for long yearned for progress. It's a term that carries with it negative connotations though so I suppose it's a useful bit of language for journalists to use to gee up their readership a little.

estimates are often quoted as saying we number anything from 0.3% to 1% of the population

For a population of just under 70 million this is between 200,000 and 700,000.

When the GRA was passed in 2004, the estimated number of transsexuals who would want a GRC was around 5,000 (less than 0.01% of the population). Any idea why this figure has increased by a factor of 100 in less than 20 years?

Any identity is necessarily/by definition a social matter. An identity of any kind depends on social relationships/negotiations to have any valid meaning. We exist as social creatures. We can be whoever we imagine ourselves to be in our own private world, however.

It is always contact with the external world and wider reality that is the tricky bit. For all of us.

Any minority moving from a position of being begrudgingly tolerated to openly accepted will see concerted push back and open intolerance. I know it doesn't seem like it at the moment but things are going to much better for this next generation. Take care and keep safe 🍀

The issue for most people here is not in not allowing people to be themselves and express how they want; but of the forceful incursion into women's spaces, services, sports and so on; and in the demand that people deny what they instinctively perceive - which is the reality of sex.

Also of course, how the 'agenda' has shifted towards children, and increasingly in recent years towards young gender non-conforming girls and lesbians.

Aside from all that, I'm often interested to know why some people believe we can be trans adults but not trans children almost as if they can place an 18 rated certificate on a well documented medical condition?

Doesn't being trans require an adult understanding about sex and sexuality? For children the idea of being the opposite sex seems to be all about stereotypes. What else could it be about? If it's about hatred of their body then there is a lot that needs to be looked at about why they hate their body.

What makes my trans child feel suicidal is not the gender dysphoria but the hideous transphobic attitudes outwardly expressed by so many people now

i suspect that what you refer to as transphobia is simply the natural and inevitable recognition of sex - which underlies all presentations and feelings about the self. You cannot blame people for being cognisant of something so elemental.

Aside from all that, I'm often interested to know why some people believe we can be trans adults but not trans children almost as if they can place an 18 rated certificate on a well documented medical condition

I think many of us question the trans narrative/explanation full stop. Whether that be in adults, or in childrenThat is not to say that we don't understand or have sympathy/compassion for those who feel and struggle in this way.

But the concern is paramount when it comes to children, because influences and narratives in childhood tend to shape the life thereafter; and because nobody wants to see a child with a healthy body have to be subject to medical or surgical treatments that could damage that body going forward. Or for a child to have to be subject to a life in which there is such obvious dissonance; both personally and socially.