Fundraisers & questions

Future campaigns are by definition uncertain

And again, you are confirming the point made. Not quite sure why it keeps getting repeated. FPFW are sat on a large sum of cash for some unknown, unspecified future campaign(s) and won't/can't say if/when they'll need to use that money but they definitely won't be asking anyone what they should do with it.

I'm glad we're clear on how transparent this all is.

so I know any campaign they have has a 95% plus of being the sort of thing I agree with

What, like campaigning to repurpose disabled toilets for the [insert current acceptable term, I've no idea what eggshells I might tread on if I pick one which is why I rarely post here these days)? Or no challenge to "legal sex" being in the same category as actual sex?

Look, I'm being devil's advocate here. I like FPFW. I like Nic. Not perfect but who is? I'm considerably more of the no pasaran bent than Nic's libfem change within structures approach but that's okay too. It's not about me. It's not about Nic.

It's about accountability and transparency. It's about making sure we all get the most bang for the buck in an environment where there's so much to do and only ordinary women's spare fivers to do it with. It's about not acting as though you're entitled to oversight of these ill-afforded fivers with no consultation with the women who have given them.

A bloody mailing list survey. Seriously. That's an affront to anyone's dignity? I really do not think so.

It's not! 'Future campaigns' isjust as vagueas RTSvague women's stuff. No one knew where RTS money was going. We don't know where FPFW money is going either. That's the point!
Future campaigns are by definition uncertain - we didn't think would need to take action over the census just a few weeks ago. What actions are needed depends on what actions others take to undermine women's rights.
This is a huge victory and I'm fully behind FPFW's strategy having watched their development from the start.

I don't know where the money is going

fairplayforwomen.com/about-us/our-beliefs/

I would be very surprised if FPFW aren't in touch with FWS

Well I haven't seen anyone on this site buying what you've been peddling up to now Shizuku so I wouldn't get your hopes up too much.

I just want to put it out there that I have a mattress to sell.

I've just read the latest update from FPFW and am happy to wait a couple of months for further information in the funding position. It seems very unreasonable to expect this until the net costs of the case are known. I also agree that when you give money to crowdfunders, it's very much a case of caveat emptor and I don't give cash unless I'm fully comfortable with both the cause and the fundraiser. In this case I'm just very happy with the result and regard it as a bonus that there should be leftover funds for future action. I also fully support FWS, am gutted by the legal decision in the JR and will donate (yet again).

We don't know where FPFW money is going either.

No, but they have a strong track record, and for many of us they've built up a lot of trust and goodwill.

That's not nothing. It can to some extent stand in for a lack of transparency.

I was prepared to donate with the clause "any leftover money goes to future campaigns" because of that record. I doubt I would have donated to RTS on that basis, as I don't believe they have any record.

Donating to Reclaim the Streets for vague women's stuff could therefore mean any of a huge range of stuff. Whereas with FPFW they have a website with a well advertised stance on sex and gender

I genuinely can't believe you just posted that. RTS - oh so vague. FPFW - so detailed on their website

It's not! 'Future campaigns' is just as vague as RTS vague women's stuff. No one knew where RTS money was going. We don't know where FPFW money is going either. That's the point!

I get people disagree with the OP but seriously! At least try not to be hypocritical about it! Either transparency matters or or doesn't. If people think the lack of transparency from FPFW is fine, fair enough. But don't try and present it as detailed when it clearly isn't.

But they are not the same. Surely all the fuss we're going through is because of the conflicting view of women's rights and even what a woman is. Donating to Reclaim the Streets for vague women's stuff could therefore mean any of a huge range of stuff. Whereas with FPFW they have a website with a well advertised stance on sex and gender and so I know any campaign they have has a 95% plus of being the sort of thing I agree with. Knowing what they meant by women and stood for wasn't true with the RTS initially.

And as for how FPFW can know which government department is next going to go down the gender/sex rabbit hole like the ONS I really don't know. At least when it does happen they should be able to act really quickly now.

www.crowdfunder.co.uk/sexinthecensus2021/updates/151379#start
They have issued an update. I think it's a bit unreasonable to expect a detailed project plan etc for something that only happened in the last couple of weeks considering they could have faced bankruptcy if they failed.

We will update with the detail once the cost assessment is complete. This is likely to be a couple of months away. In the meantime, we have already instructed our legal team to undertake the necessary evaluation work to enable us to prioritise and prepare for our next legal challenges.

Thank you again for your support

We are continuing our work in our key focus areas of prisons, sport, language and data. This case was a very welcome victory and we celebrated for a day – now it’s back to work!

And as someone else said they did say what they would do with surplus funds so people did know what they were donating to at the time - not like the other much vaguer fund that has been circulating recently - so rather unfair to moan now.

They have also been really transparent since the court case. The relevant bit from they crowdfunder page is:

"We raised £101,000 exactly. After Crowdfunder.co.uk deducts its fees + VAT, we received £93,985.79. As we promised when we launched the crowdfunder, any surplus will be put towards other Fair Play For Women campaigns."

So, really not fair to complain at all.

We need to separately try and raise money for FWS as a different thing. If we can't give anymore ourselves then keeping them high on social media will help.

I think it’s a shame that such a tiny outfit has to deal with such huge sums but that’s the nature of the beast, and necessary for legal fights.

It’s a lot of responsibility and not one I’d want.

But given they’ve said they won’t know full details for a couple of months and that they told us upfront what they would do with any extra money, I’m not complaining about any of it.

If you want a refund either contact them directly and see if that’s possible or suggest to them they contribute to FWS.

My feeling is that if you choose to donate to a crowdfunder with wording as that one had, you are choosing to trust the organisation involved to use your money wisely. There are plenty of other cases where donations are needed that are via crowd justice or otherwise more specific. If some people prefer that they can donate to those. There's no shortage of holes to dig.

I am immensely grateful to FPFW for taking on a huge challenge at such short notice. They did a brilliant job and as far as I'm concerned they can spend my £20 on champagne if they want to. I paid to have the census guidance sorted out, I got what I paid for.

I know they won't though. And FPFW with a (small in legal terms) fighting fund at the ready is an exciting prospect.

The idea of a general women's fighting fund is in theory attractive. In practice, I think it would be too difficult. It would be too hard to agree which of the many deserving projects got what money, some would miss out, it would become political and sour quickly. In my head I'm allocating my own personal fund of what I want to put in each month and sending out to projects that I want to support as they come up.

I'm happy with FPFW to keep the money for a war chest.

It is good luck (aka enormous amounts of hard work, skill and energy) that the money gathered managed to achieve the stated aim without being spent permanently (they still need the ONS to stump up as I understand)?

I agree with pp that they have enough on their plate atm and I wouldn't want to burden them with trying to organise refunds.

As I see it, the money was used to achieve the stated aim - if the ONS decided to make a large donation to FPFW, that's their business and FPFW can direct it in a way that they see fit.

This thread has been picked up by our monitors on twitter and they are sniggering about possible bankruptcies.

Some may not contribute to the next appeal because they wrongly think that FPFW have £100,000+ spare. Or conversely, think that they are contributing to a financial strapped organisation when they are not and their money would make more impact somewhere else.

I don't want some women to lose out because one organisation has better PR. It's not a criticism of any group, it's just transparency and making the best use of money.

[quote Signalbox]It would be helpful if fpfw could point out where they said at the beginning how funding would be used in the event of some being left over. I'm sure they are right but I can't find it

It's here. 6th paragraph down.

www.crowdfunder.co.uk/sexinthecensus2021[/quote]
Thank you! That's exactly what I was looking fir. Don't k ow why I couldn't see it.

I donated and was happy to let my donation go to running costs if it wasn’t needed. I’ve been involved in a few not for profit organisations and there’s huge amounts of work involved by the organisers so I felt FPFW was getting to the point where some salaries might need to be paid and did contribute to that cause.

Compared to my donation regret when I found out what Amnesty International had become I’m happy my contributions are mostly being used the way I want, (JJ and AWS not withstanding)

At this point I’d welcome more coordination between cases and I’d like to see the crowdjustice cases say who they would pass unused funds to.

I have to agree with the OP that I feel like my good will (and finances) are running thin. There’s lots of women who have been significantly impacted by Covid, yet just a handful of people seem to be starting lots of crowdfunders with no accountability and no transparency. I think it’s wrong that we seem to be funding them personally, when so many of us do lots of work (rightly so) totally unpaid.

That's a shame RedHoodGirl, which ones did you donate to?

But you did have a say. By reading the (vague) terms and choosing whether to proceed with your donation at that time.

That said, contact FPFW directly and ask to resolve it? As you would with a business if you were unhappy with the delivery of an agreed-on service?

Thanks for the reminder of FWS as I've just hopped over to give them a donation.

I don't get why people are upset. FPFW used the money for exactly the purpose described and got a brilliant result. The reimbursement would just be legal costs and probably not all of those. There would be other costs probably taken from their previously raised funds. When expenditure related just to the ONS action is finally balanced out I expect less than half the amount would be left.