For Women Scotland lose case

Yes, exactly that Vivarium. If you are in Scotland there is no legal difference between you and a TW.

The judgment only refers to the Public Boards Bill at the moment, but there is absolutely no doubt that the new definition will be used in other legislation. In fact I think that was probably the intention - introduce it into a minor piece of 'equalities' legislation that no-one will take much notice of, and then use it as a precedent.

This is from Willie Rennie today, leader of the Scottish Libdems. He's talking about the Salmond/Sturgeon issue, but I think there are several things that are relevant (my emphasis):

'Scottish Liberal Democrat leader Willie Rennie says the women who complained have been "failed".

He adds: "When they stepped up we were not there for them."

Mr Rennie adds the Conservatives were "only interested in removing Nicola Sturgeon from office rather than the facts of this terrible series of events".

He continues: "They have undermined the integrity of the independent investigator."

Mr Rennie also says that Scottish politics today "does not look pretty".

"Talk of lynching, assassination, leaking the private evidence of complaints, tabling motions of no confidence before even all the evidence had been heard, attacking a committee because it does not agree with first minister, lauding the performance of Nicola Sturgeon because she talked to a committee for over eight hours - as if the show is more important than the facts - boasting about recruiting new members on the back of this tragedy.

"No-one wins from this ugly episode."

No-one wins, but women, yet again, are the ones who get the brunt of it.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-scotland-56480968

I know logic is no strong point anywhere in this entire situation, but surely if there is no means by which TW can be differentiated from women, and no purpose in law to ever separate the two, then not only are TWW, but W are TW. We're all trans now.

In which case why is the word trans still relevant and needing protection in law? We can't identify that group as different from any other?

Faaaaaaaarking hell.

It beggars belief that we are having to deal with this shite in the 21st century.

Lots of material for books and documentaries in the years to come.

Nonny

Faaaaaaaarking hell.

You know that Mitchell and Webb thing, "hang on, are WE the baddies"? I keep asking myself if I am wrong, if I am in fact a bigot, old fashioned of thought and being silly, demanding and spoiled.

And then I read about the women being beaten and worse in lockdown by men, and that they can't have a women's only refuge and I hear my elected representatives say "inclusion matters" and ignoring the dead women piling up, and up, and up. It seems that they don't matter.

Women in Afghanistan could go to school in 1996, you know.

HOW could that JR fail? How? Anyone with eyes, or ears or who is as aware as a newborn infant can tell that people of different sexes are not the same.

No, I am not the baddie here.

It is so disappointing that the Judge couldn't step back and look at the common sense of the argument before she started down the legal arguments.

I haven't had a chance to read the full judgement and so am not aware of the legal argument to support this but whatever knots she has tied herself in, surely she can't morally move away from the original common sense position? (obviously she has, but how??)

vivariumvivariumsvivaria have a look at this.

wingsoverscotland.com/on-a-nod-and-a-wink/

FWS must be exhausted with all this. But as previous posters have said - Scottish women will fight this. The allotment is still open for digging if anyone is able

Or the important or protected kind.

For clarity, I'm a common or garden woman.

Not the fun kind.

I'm sorry to ask a really dim question - I have tried to google.

What does this MEAN? Does it mean that in law, I am the same as a trans woman? That the trans woman can access my single sex spaces because the trans woman is of the same sex class as me?

Does Scots law believe that trans women are female?

Surely no?

This so clearly has implications for the rest of the UK. I think we could rely on a spate of allotment-digging to rival the war-effort if the doughty souls of For Women Scot feel that an appeal is winnable.

And if it's not, heaven help us.

Thanks and appreciation to For Women Scot - you are in the vanguard of all this shit. Your courage and determination is really something.

I am 'Leslie'.

My name is feminine in my mother-tongue, but masculine in English. I am frequently
'mis-gendered. Until they meet me, people generally assume I am a man unless told otherwise.

Which sex am I? The one evidenced by my biology, or the one presumed by others? Am I a different sex to different people?

Am I proof of non-binaryism? Or that it is possible to be a female man? Or of fluid gender ?

Or am I simply a gender non conforming adult female human - ie a woman?

Gender is garbage, not god.

Gutted for you Scots. How is this possible in a supposed sane society?

Sigh... Thanks for trying FWS. I feel like things are starting to turn around south of the border but up here things are just getting worse. Anyway, no point in moaning, what can we do next?

You love to see a breeder suddenly realize gender is a spook. Anyways, trans rights gg no re

I'm sorry...?

I think a women’s strike is in order.

You love to see a breeder suddenly realize gender is a spook. Anyways, trans rights gg no re

Er, what?

Women have to move over for ALL men, even the ones who don’t want to be men anymore.

Just keep moving over (until you fall of that seat)

Scotland has become a theocracy.

Good point. But as we have established, the men just stick their fingers in their ears as ever. Can we blame the church of Scotland for this?

So what’s the next step? We’re both Scottish and women, since when did we sit down and shut up??