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Original poster

Jolene, and other anti-feminist anthems

817 replies

StealthPolarBear · 20/03/2021 20:14

Just to say this is a light-hearted chat thread.
I love jolene, sing it with a minor adaptation every time I'm cleaning the windows. I have no idea about the background, but it must come near the top of the least feminist songs ever!
Another which I've just heard is sheryl crow, strong enough. "lie to me, I promise I'll believe, lie to me, but please don't leave"
Brilliant song, awful lyrics :)
Any others?

OP posts:
Fountainsoftea · 20/03/2021 21:48

neversleeping my gun instructor plays the Akon track. Every single time I get stuck in the disrespectful/ neighbourhood hos bit and want to discuss it. Then lose my focus.

bonbonours · 20/03/2021 21:48

@elkiedee Yes, centrefold. That he feels betrayed that his innocent school crush is now a centrefold. But of course it's perfectly ok for him to be he looking at a porn mag.

newrubylane · 20/03/2021 21:48

@Neversleepingever - have often wondered this 😁

NiceGerbil · 20/03/2021 21:48

But RTFT but I don't see Jolene as anti feminist.

I hear it as a wrenchingly emotional song about one woman who is terrified the partner she loves is going to be unfaithful/ leave.

I always think when I listen to it as well, that we don't know Jolene is actually after her man. It's a song about fear and insecurity.

Anti feminist. Erm. Too many to mention!

Daft punk get lucky is creepy as fuck and it pissed me off because I've been a fan forever.

MissBarbary · 20/03/2021 21:47

@RedDogsBeg

I love a bit of Led Zeppelin 'Whole Lotta Love', but no you are not going to be my back door man even if you are Robert Plant!
To be fair the lyrics were pinched from an old blues song. Sick Again is much worse.
iamaMused · 20/03/2021 21:47

The Corrs " what can I do?" Shame as I loved that song in the 90's I recently downloaded it and I think it's probably the first time I've ever listens to the lyrics.

FlowersAreBeautiful · 20/03/2021 21:45

Olly Murs - Hey you beautiful. You say no but mean yes Hmm. Actually a few of his songs on the same album have some questionable lyrics so I stopped listening to him

WarOnWomen · 20/03/2021 21:45

@dotdashdashdash

Babybirds "you're gorgeous" always seemed distasteful to me

Pretty sure that's about exploitation. So it's a feminist song for me. Anyone else agree with me?

EarthSight · 20/03/2021 21:45

Blurred Lines.

bonbonours · 20/03/2021 21:44

The song that pisses me off most and makes me change the radio station is "It wasn't me" by Shaggy. Basically laughing about cheating on his girlfriend.

Neversleepingever · 20/03/2021 21:44

Why why WHY Akon, when you 'tried to describe that girl without being disrespectful'... Did you settle on 'sexy bitch'

Wondermule · 20/03/2021 21:44

Does your mother know by ABBA? I mean wtf:

There's that look in your eyes
I can read in your face that your feelings are driving you wild
Ah, but girl you're only a child

Well I can dance with you honey
If you think it's funny
Does your mother know that you're out?
And I can chat with you baby
Flirt a little maybe
Does your mother know that you're out?

Take it easy (take it easy)
Better slow down girl
That's no way to go
Does your mother know?
Take it easy (take it easy)
Try to cool it girl
Take it nice and slow
Does your mother know?

I can see what you want
But you seem pretty young to be searching for that kind of fun
So maybe I'm not the one
Now you're so cute, I like your style
And I know what you mean when you give me a flash of that smile (smile)
But girl you're only a child

SmokedDuck · 20/03/2021 21:44

@PlumpAndDeliciousFatcat

She wants to stay but needs to be given an excuse because of how the rest of society will judge it.

Nice idea but the line “Say, what’s in this drink?” kills this reading for me.

That's a little anachronistic, though.
Spidder · 20/03/2021 21:43

gwenhwyfar it's basically: if you loved me, you'd stop talking about it and shag me.

I remember being 14 and my mate's much cooler 18 yr old sister dismissing it like that to usGrin

Original poster
StealthPolarBear · 20/03/2021 21:43

Oh and PS I'm from the police :o

OP posts:
Gwenhwyfar · 20/03/2021 21:42

@HeartshapedFox

Baby It’s Cold Outside comes up every Christmas - it sounds pretty bad nowadays but apparently in the original 1940s context it’s about a woman who very much wants to stay over with her man worried her reputation will be ruined if she does.
That's how I hear it now too. It's very clearly a flirtation and not harassment.
Rupertbeartrousers · 20/03/2021 21:42

That The Calling song - “wherever you will go” makes me feel uneasy... I don’t even know what it’s about, is he dying but intending to haunt her?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 20/03/2021 21:42

Is it anti-feminist to tell someone there are other options than prostitution?

No, it's only problematic if he's then going to follow her around saying that she belongs to him and his poor heart aches with every breath she takes, smile she fakes etc.

HeartshapedFox · 20/03/2021 21:42

@PlumpAndDeliciousFatcat

She wants to stay but needs to be given an excuse because of how the rest of society will judge it.

Nice idea but the line “Say, what’s in this drink?” kills this reading for me.

Even that has context - apparently people used to say that as a joke because it was harder to get alcohol then and there was literally nothing in the drink - that was the joke. I’m trying to find the link to the article about it but I can’t! But I absolutely agree it sounds very bad now.
Serenster · 20/03/2021 21:41

@dotdashdashdash

Babybirds "you're gorgeous" always seemed distasteful to me
It's definitely about an exploitative relationship, but is being sung by a man, seemingly from his own perspective...
elkiedee · 20/03/2021 21:41

The song with the weirdest lyrics that we danced to at middle school discos (so equivalent to years 5 to 8) in the 1980s was about and from the viewpoint of a man realising the beautiful girl he had a crush on at school is a "Centerfold" - the J Geils Band.

SmokedDuck · 20/03/2021 21:41

@Blibbyblobby

I guess most people don't listen to music to teach them what it's socially acceptable for women, or anyone else, to think.

Unfortunately, the cumulative effect of the lyrics we listen to is part of what tells them, and society in general, what it's socially acceptable for women, or anyone else, to think. That is exactly what sets the society's culture, and just because someone isn't intending to be socialised doesn't stop it happening.

On the theme of the thread:

Take another little piece of my heart.

Love the song but OMG such a hymn to immolating your self worth to support your man's fragile ego!

I think there is some truth to that, OTOH I also think a lot of it comes down to very basic, raw emotions around sex and love, by which I mean, romantic/sexual love. People don't feel willing to throw all good sense and caution to the side, or make extreme gestures, because society tells them to, teenagers don't freak out when separated from the objects of their affection because people tell them to. People don't feel like there is some sort of imperative of universal justice that if they love someone enough, or make them realise how they feel, they will be loved back, because someone tells them to. They are almost universal types of emotions.

Pretty much every society ever has seen those things as potentially seriously socially disruptive and leading to all kinds of bad outcomes, and tried to put a lid on them in some way. Maybe ours less than a lot of others, though. In some ways we're overly romantic about them - where most cultures know young people (and sometimes older ones) have these kinds of feelings, and they might be expressed in art, they don't tend to see them as so positive or anything to build a long term relationship on.

SheikahSlate · 20/03/2021 21:41

Also, another thing I like about Jolene, is that rather than the utterly unsisterly 'don't you wish your girlfriend was hot like me' vibe (:O=), the speaker in Jolene ardently admires, and respects, the force that is Jolene.

Original poster
StealthPolarBear · 20/03/2021 21:41

Agree. As I say the worst bit for me is that her happiness depends on whether jolene steals him or not. Independently of all the other stuff that's awful.

OP posts:
Gwenhwyfar · 20/03/2021 21:41

I've just re-listened to More than Words and don't get what's wrong with it at all. I definitely didn't hear anything rapey.