Consent for women

Imagine that scenario.

A: I want to have sex with you

B: No, thanks.

A: Expain yourself. I demand it!

'I dont like your attitude' is not a personal attack, its a statement of how a person feels about your behaviour.

This thread is about consent on a practical level not on the academic study of how our sexuality develops. It would be pushing boundaries to bring up the wider academic topic with someone who has just turned down your advances.

Also please show me where I ever said no shouldn’t mean no, or said anyone should give in to pressure to have sex with someone they want, because that has literally... not happened. It’s actually baffling that some pretty surface level sociological analysis has caused such offence. Again, more telling about you than it is me, when in every post I’ve been polite, repeated that I agree with the OP and not resorted to personal attacks like ‘I don’t like your attitude’.

#BeKind

#WimminEXPLAINYourNoIsItGoodEnoughForMeeeeee

We have had a perfect example of what young people are up against, being shamed and guilt tripped if they don’t analyse why they aren’t sexually attracted to a particular person, type or group. Being pushed, through social pressure to be kind and inclusive, into justifying their boundaries and their “No”.

If someone says no, just accept it that is all.

Define your terms; we are talking about one to one situations. Not academia.

Okay so academics studying sexual politics and questioning how our preferences arise are just trying to manipulate women are they? Kate Millett (a radical feminist) was trying to erode women’s boundaries by saying sex and attraction doesn’t form in a vacuum? Tell me again how you enjoy critical analysis?

So it’s fine to make assumptions that bi women are more promiscuous, prone to STIs and unable to be faithful is it? Or it’s fine for men to only want to date them because they fetishise them? I don’t think prejudices are “spurious” personally. I think they’re harmful to the women on the receiving end

Who is making these assumptions?

I can see several reasons why someone might not want to date you- although none of them are the ones you've listed.

Or, what Maud said

Critical analysis is very popular here.

You simply dont like that others are years ahead of you in the Sex/sexuality conversation and subsequent analysis.

No means no is the red line.

A necessary one.

Firm borders are required for certain groups:

Children
Homosexual women
Mentally compromised women
Incapacitated women (in comas/in prison)

Lesbian women, from the above list, are the most able to say "No". With, or without explanation.

They are the gatekeepers for bi-sexual women or men being in their sexual fold.

Amazing how women who persist in saying 'no' frequently get the 'I wouldn't fancy you anyway' or 'you're just too stupid to understand my brilliance' responses. Sometimes both

I have an ex that used to try to use coercion to get sex when he wanted it. I recognise the tactics and dynamic of coercion; the main one of course being that one person wants something that the other does not want to give; and they are prepared to ignore their boundaries to get it.

MY ex used to demand explanations. His demands used to be dressed up as 'just trying to have a reasonable adult discussion'. If I went along with his reasonable discussion, the conversation would lead to another attempt to get what he wanted.

You don't owe anyone sex, and you don't owe anyone an explanation.
The more pressure they apply the more you should say no.

But in a general sense - I think it is worth discussing the aversion to bi women in the sense that they’re seen as having been ‘defiled’ by a man and made less worthy, because there is A LOT of social context around that

I've no idea what you're on about- who thinks this?

But how many times do you need to be told? I don't fancy women. And tbh I really don't like your attitude.

• But in a general sense - I think it is worth discussing the aversion to bi women in the sense that they’re seen as having been ‘defiled’ by a man and made less worthy, because there is A LOT of social context around that.

It sounds like the topic for a separate thread, rather than trying to make it the subject of this one tbh.

I'm not much into soul searching if I don't fancy someone either.

Right so you don’t think anything is worth thinking about beyond ‘I think and feel this therefore it is set in stone’? You don’t think preferences and choices are influenced by society around us? You don’t have any interest in developing a deeper understanding of yourself and your position in the world? Shame, because it’s actually fascinating how political the personal is and how these things intertwine. One of my dating preferences excludes narrow minded people with no curiosity so our paths would be unlikely to cross anyway.

Well said MissBarbary and PurpleHoodie!

You’re totally missing my point. I’m not questioning why a straight woman wouldn’t want to date me. That’s fine. See my post above

You are missing the point. You have listed a whole host of what you consider spurious reasons for not considering bi- women. I don't need to justify my refusal to find an acceptable reason.

Ted

No.

The conversation has already been had amongst women.

It is passed down to/and between women. Explanations and all.

There is no more to be said. There is no debating. It is knowledge passed on between women.

No means no.

But in a general sense - I think it is worth discussing the aversion to bi women in the sense that they’re seen as having been ‘defiled’ by a man and made less worthy, because there is A LOT of social context around that.

Having said that, that particular preference is one I have a lot of sympathy with because of the societal power structures in which men sit, and I can understand why on a visceral, moral and political level, a lesbian wouldn’t want to increase her proximity to men.

I think it’s different though when it’s flipped to women who don’t want to date bi men, much of that is rooted in homophobia and ‘real man’ stereotypes.

But I’ll say it louder for people at the back: theoretical analysis of ones preferences doesn’t mean you have to have sex with anyone you don’t want to!

If a lesbian woman doesn't want to have sex with a bi-sexual women then that is the end of the conversation. End. Of.

We know the reasons already. No need to try and push boundaries. We get enough of that shit from men.