Misogyny will now be recorded as a hate crime

It’s so weird. I don’t know what is happening! They are collecting data of crimes motivated by mysogyny. The data will inform what happens next. Like what? It’s a bit vague and sounds like a paper exercise.

@GreyhoundG1rl

My own MP assured me that transwomen are in more danger than women because there was no data to prove otherwise You could claim anything under the sun as fact if that was the criteria What a complete fool. Brilliant news, though, thank God.

There's no data to suggest that aliens haven't colonised Earth or that the Queen is not actually a giant lizard. Therefore...

Are withdrawn amendments usually reported in this way? Never but then this is Stonewall and Stella Creasy reporting which requires a good deal of latitude.

Maybe they're a bit hacked off at the losses

This is so confusing and I can see this has been picked up on already. Everywhere this seems to be reported as a triumphant law change and rather than an experiment. You would really think it was to enshrined in law. Are withdrawn amendments usually reported in this way?

I'm not holding my breath. It is only on a trial basis. Could well be quietly dropped later, or the end date for the trial quietly pass.

Ok. I got way too over excited.

Actually reflecting on it and other posters thoughts actually, proving as a victim you were a victim and that person was motivated by hate according to a characteristic ... well actually it will often be bloody hard to prove, won't it? I'm thinking of Pumpkins experience here (sorry that happened to him Pumpkin and he's recovered ).

It feels a bit like in light of the public's women's mood it looks like a quick win but could just be throwing us some scraps. And yes, I have concerns about the "experimental " basis too. However I think our persistence may have been underestimated

This is a very good time to print off the entire of terfisaslur, all the collected screenshots, all the letters, all the death and rape threats, all the lovely, kind stuff about bleeding gashes and taggy titted harridans and art exhibitions of blood stained t shirts and barbed wire wrapped basball bats, and dump it in its entirety on the desk of everyone possible. If they want to see hate related to women, we got tons of it, everywhere. They can compare and decide for themselves which kind of women get which kind of hate and what crimes are taken very seriously and what crimes are regarded as just people expressing themselves.

This.

YES! This is excellent news and eons overdue.

Is there still time for women to complete the VAWG consultation (did mine at the weekend)? I wonder if this will feed in?

This is a bandwagon jump in response to public feeling, and as the vigil was, will be a focus for commandeering to adjust women to mean what some political lobbies would prefer it to mean and focus on.

This is a very good time to print off the entire of terfisaslur, all the collected screenshots, all the letters, all the death and rape threats, all the lovely, kind stuff about bleeding gashes and taggy titted harridans and art exhibitions of blood stained t shirts and barbed wire wrapped basball bats, and dump it in its entirety on the desk of everyone possible. If they want to see hate related to women, we got tons of it, everywhere. They can compare and decide for themselves which kind of women get which kind of hate and what crimes are taken very seriously and what crimes are regarded as just people expressing themselves.

In a country where rape is more or less legal and open equality is normal, I honestly don't expect this to go anywhere productive, but it will be very helpful to take advantage of this window to get the HoC and HoLs thoroughly informed and aware of the aspects of the situation not covered in the Stonewall Champion information materials.

This is the statement in the HoL. Stella Creasey is wrong, Baroness Williams said no decision on terminology has been taken. She also refers to sex or gender or age as characteristics the Law Commission is looking at. She never says sex and gender which if used would muddy the statistics.

parliamentlive.tv/event/index/4ab0ed94-985c-4919-97b8-4d2f5ab429af?in=17:30:00&out=17:43:00

'Home Office minister Baroness Williams of Trafford said that the change would be made initially on an “experimental” basis.'

It is not actually law, it is just being trialled. I imagine if we let the momentum over Sarah's death die down they will quietly decide not to implement this into law.

Cwenthryth I also am confuddled. 87B was withdrawn, which was a big deal because it would have taken female out of DA bill when the majority of crimes in DV situations are against women. The government committed to an We will ask police forces to record crimes of violence where v perceives it as motivated by hostility based on their sex

We will start experimental collection of data this autumn.
The details still to be worked thru. Not exclude gender, but the details still being worked thru Gender wont be excluded but complexity is noted and nothing definite. This is not law

The CPS keep making definitions that are not law and it is time legal definitions were imposed. The conflation of sex and gender and the implications of this are being (always were) understood by government but they may have hoped we would be using, by custom and practice, gender so that the issues associated with these differences would be easier.

Unfortunately women are waking up

It's in the Times this morning too

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/misogyny-to-be-classed-as-hate-crime-from-autumn-ztkbztjwd?shareToken=6c8c2fef2dbdde8fde8ff84fad54d114

Well I’m mightily confuddled by this - last night amendment 87B was withdrawn ‘following thoughtful debate in HoL’ but this morning the intent of that amendment is just announced without it being passed by Parliament anyway? And it isn’t clear whether it is sex or sex ‘and gender’?

What is the actual source announcement of this, rather than a media report or tweets?

Yay! That's fantastic news. About bloody time.

Stella Creasy confirms it here.

twitter.com/stellacreasy/status/1372288165759827968?s=21

I think that the change in wording is a good things because it was originally so badly worded that it included men.

I think that hate crime can only be on whether someone is perceived to have that characteristic. The good thing about that is that it includes female people who might not consider themselves to be women (for example Jack Monroe) who also are often victims of this sort of crime.

If they are celebrating, I think we can be certain that this will be applied in ways that are not remotely sex-based.

That’s not to say this is a negative thing, but I don’t think it’s safe to assume this is sex-based on the evidence of a single sentence in a report.

I agree. I guess they imagine it will work like it does now where they can get the policies around misogynistic hate speech worded as "gender" in the police forces and other organisations.

IMO hate crime legislation needs to go. The whole thing is a mess. But perhaps if women start reporting every perceived instance of hate it will give the authorities some food for thought, and they might look closer at the whole thing...

Stella Creasy campaigned with Stonewall as her first port of call.

Fawcett are at the forefront of insisting that some men are women.

If they are celebrating, I think we can be certain that this will be applied in ways that are not remotely sex-based.

That’s not to say this is a negative thing, but I don’t think it’s safe to assume this is sex-based on the evidence of a single sentence in a report.

The 'perceived' bit isn't just about what the victim thinks.

My uncle was hospitalised after being beaten up for being 'al qaeda Muslim scum'.

He's a white British atheist but with his dark colouring he could easily pass for Middle Eastern.

It was still a hate crime because the attacker thought he was beating up a Muslim for being Muslim even though he wasn't.

Sorry, but misogyny isn't actually being made a hate crime. Incidents are just being recorded by the police. If there's any prosecutions they won't get any uplift in the sentencing. This is just an extension of the Nottingham scheme to all police forces as a temporary excercise in gathering data while waiting for the Law Commision to report on Hate Crime legislation.
I'm not at all convinced hate crimes are the way to go.

As if religion was considered a basis for hate crime when sex wasn't, something which is not even tenuously based in reality when sex actually is. The mind fucking reels.