Bristol Uni SU forbids women discussing male violence without male guardians present

Did a little bit of digging today, amazing how much better the garden looks already.

I mean in unis the media etc.

What individuals discuss between themselves is totally different.

Also I did say that imo anything should be up for debate. And I gave my reasons for that.

Between friends is different though. That's not a free speech issue surely!

If I'm in the pub and men want to discuss why X thing I feel very strongly about and disagree with and is personal. Eg when metoo plenty of men at work tried to pull me into 'discussions' that were actually just goading.

Then I can say i don't want to discuss this.

That's not repressing free speech. It's perfectly fine.

Perhaps we can agree to disgree.

I think free speech is hugely important. The Brexit debate was scarey. I speak five languages, have lived in a couple of other EU countries, and have sat in my share of EU meetings, yet people I had previously considered friends would not allow me reservations about the future of the European Project. I disagreed with them, ergo I had to be 'othered' by being called racist. Ditto Palestine. Anything short of the Corbyn position is unacceptable. Who cares if this might, from a different perspective, look like anti semitism.

And obviously the same approach is used by the TWAW crew. Dissent is not allowed. Dissenters must be punished.

Not what Universities should be about.

Specifically the debate about women's right to single sex spaces needs to be just that, a respectful debate. Not women good, trans bad or vice versa. The University needs to emphasise the importance of free speech.

Totally different issue. And an extremely sensitive one.

Certainly though it does seem that debate etc on anything even slightly divisive is not allowed.

I do agree that anything heading into areas with views that will appeal to those whose views cause real danger should not be allowed in su. Debate yes. Debate with those who hold extreme views. Yes. Let's hear why they think that way and see how it stands up to challenge.

Group for neo Nazis or incels etc for like minded to get together in a 'safe space' is a no.

There's a line for me. Know others have a range of opinions.

However this issue stands on its own and pulling in unrelated very contraversial topics does not help.

A group for female students to talk about male violence should not be contraversial at all. It poses no risks.

I will disagree slightly having just heard about the experience of a student who dared, in a department wide student group chat, suggest that there could be more than one view on Palestine. Without actually revealing what their view was. Cue a pile on, and some offensive direct messages. Other students obviously agreed and were concerned about impact on Jewish classmates, but had no wish to stick their heads above the parapet and be called out in the same fashion.

Social media seems to allow small groups to dictate group thinking and crowd out other voices, whether these be women, or those who believe there is room for debate and compromise in the Middle East.

Bristol U is in the education business and should be concerned at any attempts to use bullying tactics to close off debate and to silence legitimate views.

Yes su England scrutiny council

www.nus.org.uk/national-scrutiny-council

My point with that post is re the law.

Student Union is not an employer (well it is but their meetings aren't covered by employment laws iyswim). It's not a provider of goods and services it's an interest group for students.

I would imagine (but will check) that student unions have to abide by some kind of rules from some Central group or similar? Seems likely.

So no I don't think it's illegal.

In ye olden days not even a few years ago. A group for young women (female) to discuss male violence. Would have angered plenty of male students. Misandry. Not fair. Etc etc.

Now the doors are open.

And make no mistake. As with the swimming pool women's sessions stuff. Men don't want their own groups as well. They just don't want women to have anything just for them. Snoffair. They go to disrupt.

With an SU group for women to talk about MVAWG.

Other groups who want to talk about male violence can and should form groups. Women won't mind. Women won't care at all. It's fine.

groups for trans males, or trans people. LGB men. Men in general. Go for it. It will be more productive as the reasons for and experiences of male violence have different characteristics and it's all important.

But no. Obviously not. Men don't like it. So here we are.

*PurpleHoodie
NeedToKnow101

This is awful. Im so ashamed that so many of the ongoing attacks on women's rights have been by white males on black or brown women. Can't they see how fucking awful (racist, sexist, misogynistic, homophobic) they are being?

This cannot be stated enough.
It can't, resposting.

No doubt the people trying to silence these women consider themselves the last word in tolerance and free-thinking. All while behaving like a totalitarian mob.*

Absolutely this! 🤬😤😖😡

The conversation here encapsulates one of the main issues with this situation.

In ye olden days. People can and did set up effects, groups, meetings for certain groups of people.

The socially accepted and socially enforces approach was that you didn't go to things for groups you were not a member of.

Elderly women didn't rock up to groups set up for elderly men (there's one of those groups locally to me).

People who were not refugees from Syria didn't go to groups for refugees from Syria.

Men did not go to groups for women to meet and socialise with other local women.

Etc etc

Unless they were like Marla from fight club which I imagine was uncommon but they would have been given short shrift.

Those social conventions all remain in place bar one. One. Not two. Elderly women in I'm sure wouldn't attend a group for elderly men. Wouldn't think if it.

But for one case the convention no longer holds. And the change in convention came suddenly, with no discussion, and with massive backing for anyone who got told no.

Policies were changed across the board. GG, YHA, sport, school facilities, who goes to a female prison, prized and competitions for women, all women short lists. Language, definitions, law was misrepresented/ lied about. History was rewritten without a second thought (GG has apparently always been single gender not single sex!!!???!).

And so on.

In ye olden days men who were enraged by women being allowed to have 'special treatment' by having things away from men used to eg complain about the being an hour swimming for women only. And sometimes this led to then being cancelled even though they were totally lawful and presumably attended well enough to make them worthwhile.

I've heard plenty of bog standard middle aged white blokes (work) complaining about 'hang gliding clubs for Muslim women' (imaginary), how women are being unfairly advantaged over men at work (40% pay gap about 80% male workforce, male CEO etc). Etc etc

Loads of men have always resented women doing things or our issues being discussed. See the ddos attacks, the invasions from male dominated sites, etc etc for years and before this particular issue was even on the agenda.

Now, and only with things for women and girls. Males shout for and get access.

They don't set up their own things oh no. That's not their job is it. Women are the ones who are expected to drive volunteering, charity, helping others etc etc. And it's not right to have stuff for us which leaves men out. Bloody selfish who do they think they are?

So now tada! No problem. Go where you like and join whatever you like. If challenged then they are exclusionary, bigoted. And their group or whatever should either change or close. Fast.

The approach that males being denied is the worst kind of hate extends to contact sports, prisons and secure mental health wards.

The fact that this is what loads of males have always wanted, is a handy coincidence as that's what the trans activists with support from everyone to the police, the NHS, schools, clubs, etc etc have given them.

Twitter link…

mobile.twitter.com/WomenTalk_Back/status/1439635347747581956

I have seen that the group Women Talk Back are hoping to challenge Bristol Uni Students Union in court, over its treatment of the group. There is some digging & gardening going on. Worth looking in to.

Really good point Salty

Bristol University AND SU Bristol need educating on the Equality Act 2010. Now.

I didn’t realise that the Bristol SU was above the law? What about the 9 protected characteristics which include sex and gender reassignment (not gender identity).

Little dig completed

They are pathetic bullies.

Springtime

Thanks for this thread. It reminded me to do some planting

Some lovely flowers have been planted overnight

Scientist it's on the same crowd funding site as the old one. I think you might find it if you Google university challenged. Or have a look at the twitters of rrs or women talk back.

The new crowdfunder is doing fine - only went live yesterday and she's up to around £3,500. I love a bit of composting on a sunny day.