Tuesday 9th March - could be a big day

JE: Umbrella terms such as race, ethnicity, sex means ONS can ask a range of questions about these topics.

[not clear here if ONS thinks 'age' is an umbrella term 'you're only as old as you feel']

/30

Gardenbird48 - If people fill in the sex question with their self identified sex and then choose not to complete the optional GI question (which some of mimmy’s followers have said) - they are literally erasing trans people from the data and will undermine the argument for trans specific services including the new GIDS clinics. Bizarre.

Exactly this. They are shooting themselves in the foot. They're already crowing about how they've answered "female" on the sex question and "there's nothing anyone can do about it".

As someone who is trans, we are in desperate need of trans-specific services - just as women are in need of women-only services. It's wholly defeating the object of the exercise. I've already completed mine with my correct biological sex and corresponding gender identity.

Utterly sick of all the "warm fuzzy gender feelz" brigade constantly undermining the need for accurate data provision for services for both women and transsexuals. Sadly, based on what's going on in social media, FPFW's much needed win is not going to change anything practically. People are going to lie, and bar cross referencing birth certificates and each individual submission, the data is going to be skewed.

Urban Dictionary for legal terms?

Judge speak
Surprised = any variant on gobsmacked, appalled, do you think I am stupid, do you think I haven’t spotted the gaping hole in your case.

I am having difficulty understanding = please try again because at the moment your argument is somewhere between unclear and utter bollocks and I am giving you another go so I can decide which it is.

Judge "I'm having difficulty understanding"

Mic drop right there!

I dont think it’s a good sign of a judge is “having difficulty understanding!”

Also I love the word bobbins 😆

Gosh, this ONS case is more interesting than I originally gave it credit for (sorry FPFW - I mean I thought it might be a drier technical debate re ONS guidance).

Surely "modern dictionaries" don't equal definitions laid down in law

But secrecy is a recurring theme.

From the original GRA.

Also, all the Awareness and PR releases, yet in spite of all of those, no one is supposed to be able to tell or know.

Keeping fingers crossed for today.

JE: "Sex can include a range of possible concepts; biological, social and so on". A 'modern dictionary definition' includes social aspects of sex. /29

The Census law uses "umbrella terms". It does not constrain the definition of sex. There could be a range of possible concepts of sex; social, legal, physical etc. It isn't restricted to birth certificate and GRC only

doesn't that totally contradict this:

JC explains Census Order states that one of the 'demographic particulars' that must be asked is 'sex' with options of either male or female. It is a crime not to provide an answer. This is a factual question not one of 'what best describes your sex' /13

Judge says "ONS doesn't get to choose what sex is". ONS must simply do as its required to by the Census Order. JC says: The question must be "what IS your sex"

I don’t envy Sir James with that one. Official stats should be based on people’s beliefs not objective criteria. It must take all his years at the Bar to be able to deliver that with a straight face.

The Census law uses "umbrella terms". It does not constrain the definition of sex. There could be a range of possible concepts of sex; social, legal, physical etc. It isn't restricted to birth certificate and GRC only /27

Judge "I'm having difficulty understanding" /28

The Census law uses "umbrella terms". It does not constrain the definition of sex. There could be a range of possible concepts of sex; social, legal, physical etc. It isn't restricted to birth certificate and GRC only /27

What's social sex now? Is this another weird way to conflate it with gender?

The answer is only constrained only by what the respondent believes their sex to be.

Hippie statisticians?

Sir James now sets out ONS's defence.
Sex must be a matter of statutory interpretation.
The answer is only constrained only by what the respondent believes their sex to be. It is not related to what's on documents. /26

Umm what????

You really really can't have laws based on the belief that reality is in the eye of the beholder imo

The defences argument looks... interesting